The bottom line is that Has/Tak wouldn't have been able to produce this many molds without the demand they garnered from the popularity of the movies.

That's not necessarily a bad thing. The movie has yielded a lot of RUBBISH toys like Fast Action Battlers, Robot Replicas, Stealth Force, RPMs, Power Bots, Cyber Slammers, Battle Chargers, Ultimate Bumblebee, Combiner Class Devastator etc etc. (-_-)

I agree, some of the crap that came out of the movie lines was wasted plastic IMHO but I bet some one found it under their Christmas tree and loved it. Some of it though was pretty nice (NOT Combiner Class Devastator) and the proliferation of third party accessories has brought to us what Has/Tak just won't produce. :deadhorse

 

City Commander and Protector are prime examples of the parts-former accessories they won't do. I have no idea why they won't build updated versions of the combiners with real fists and feet like they used to. If Energon Superion and Bruticus were sold with real fists and feet like the old sets were that would be sweet but instead they sold them with the flat clear plastic crap and we had to wait for a third party to produce them and have them retail at $80+ a set. So here's hoping that 5 to 10 years from now when the series gets a reboot that Has/Tak direct their efforts at better designs having WFC level of quality AND the rebooted movies have a director that gives a crap about great story making.

City Commander and Protector are prime examples of the parts-former accessories they won't do. I have no idea why they won't build updated versions of the combiners with real fists and feet like they used to. If Energon Superion and Bruticus were sold with real fists and feet like the old sets were that would be sweet but instead they sold them with the flat clear plastic crap and we had to wait for a third party to produce them and have them retail at $80+ a set. So here's hoping that 5 to 10 years from now when the series gets a reboot that Has/Tak direct their efforts at better designs having WFC level of quality AND the rebooted movies have a director that gives a crap about great story making.

The Energon Gestalts have clear plastic hands and feet because they're also Energon weapons, part of the whole theme of Energon. Doesn't translate that well to Classicsverse which is why I totally skipped the Universe repaints. IMO HasTak haven't produced a decent gestalt toy since Car Robot/RiD. The Super Link/Energon Gestalts were okay - and interesting remake of the old "Scramble Gestalt" gimmick (i.e. interchangeable limbs between teams) although having only two moulds for the limbs for each set was disappointing. Anyway, as part of the Scramble Gestalt gimmick, each of the limbformer's accessory needed to be able to transform into a hand, foot and weapon. We know that the more modes you try to pack into something, the less impressive each individual mode will look. Also, there's nothing necessarily wrong with the way they look as hands and feet. It's only when Hasbro tried to make them fit into Classicsverse that people thought they looked bad and through biased G1 eyes wanted more G1-like hands and feet, which is purely a subjective preference. But if Hasbro wanted to make new accessories for the Energon gestalts into Classicsverse, those hands and feet would still need to be able to transform to hand foot and weapon. Do the 3rd party hands and feet do that or are they just detachable accessories like G1? Cos detachable gestalt parts are something we've not seen in Transformer gestalts since 1993! Every gestalt since has featured self-contained gestalt parts. e.g. Tripredacus, Magnaboss, JRX (Rail Racer), Build King (Landfill) -- all their gestalt hands, feet and head are self-contained and NOT detachable accessories. The Energon gestalts have self-contained heads and the hands and feet are self-attachable weapons; i.e. they're still incorporable to the individual gestalt robot's robot and vehicle modes as weapons and not just "store away and hope you don't lost them" accessories like we had during G1 and G2 ('cept for Lio Kaiser whose hands and feet were self-contained, although his head was detachable and could be lost; still, pretty damn impressive in 1989!).

 

City Commander... that's not a terribly fun toy to play with. You have to pull the entire trailer apart into pieces and reassemble it to form the armour. And even then, a LOT of the trailer is wasted and not used for the armour, and instead forms that ridiculously oversized gun that's too heavy for Ultra Magnus to even hold up. Also, including the trailer would make the toy very expensive... the cab robot alone is a Voyager Class. Add the cost of the trailer and you'd be paying close to Leader Class price for it. Might as well just make a Leader Class Ultra Magnus toy to begin with -- which is exactly what they did with Animated Ultra Magnus.

 

Keep in mind that in order for a toy or accessory to work for Hasbro, it has to fulfill certain criteria such as:

+ Will it appeal to kids? Children are still the majority consumer market for Transformer toys. Having detachable non-incorporable gestalt accessories was something Transformers long before kids of today were even born. Their standards/expectations are form self-incorporated gestalt parts. City Commander is an accessory pack with wheels... not a terribly fun toy. I don't mean that the toy needs to be loaded with stupid gimmicks to make it fun (I think that's often Hasbro's mistake)... but engineering wise you need to make it fun to play with (and engineering is often compromised when the toy is overwhelmed by its gimmick).

+ Is it cost effective? Each toy Hasbro creates and makes is done so within a very strict tight arse budget where even every last drop of paint has to be accounted for (that's why Animated Bumblebee's rockets don't have red tips like on the stock photo prototype). Each toy has to be sold at a defined price point. There's no point making a really uber cool toy for fans that'll blow the budget (it'd be like watching Homer Simpson make his dream car -- it's got everything _he_ loves but totally blew the budget sending his brother broke! :P This is extreme satirical example, but you get the idea ;))

I'm in the minority....

 

I definately have no desire to watch animated cartoons.

 

I also think they are overdoing it with the movies, while i appreciate what Bay has done in creating a new TFer line. I think it's a tad too alienesque, and the writing is suspect. I liked #1 and thought #2 had more flaws than redeemable qualities. I will definately see #3 tho.

 

IMHO, I would like to see things attempt to be more reality based. I want to see a series of ALL CARS - autobots and decepticons alike. I also would like to see them damageable - THUS having a "REASON" to have to hide here on earth. Less ultra explosions and more storyline/writing. Fights that leave characters damaged, and meaningful. I don't mind the human interaction AT ALL, and even see it as necessary. To me - all men, of all ages love cars. They need to do more with this and write in more personality traits to the cars. I would like to see more use of vintage g1 characteres and stop introducing new ones. As far as the graphics, I like the type of graphics that Citroen C4 commercials were made using. It doesn't have to be ultra expensive to get the point across. I would like to see this as a TV series - or (thinking outside the box) return to the old days when movies first came out and have move-based series - ie, releasing 2-4 movies a year! Slightly reduced in cost to regular movies - but would create a loyal following that would pay to go see each episode.

 

 

** Even this has human interaction - shows transformatio - and I think a whole series could be based on this alone - and would not break the bank whatsoever. IT was cost effective for commercials!! Good writing and character developement would make this an awesome series.

 

 

 

It would be so easy to write in the gov't as a bad guy. A secret agency of the gov't working with the decipticons, as they hunt down the autobots. The decepticons have their own agenda as well. The gov't secretly trying to reproduce the technology - leading to a season finale of creating black prime. The decepticons continually getting new upgrades and armor backed by the gov't. The autobots, the underdog with their mission to stop the decipticons, while the gov't constantly double crosses them and won't heed their warnings.

 

A big part of it would be creating PERSONALITY to the characters - which was a big aspects of the original G1's. The commercial revenue from auto makers, tech industry, colleges/robotics, cofee makers, etc would be there.

 

IMHO, most of the ideas I hear are too animated/nerdy for a wide audience, or too lofty and thus expensive. NO one seems to be shooting for mass audience the way this could.

 

 

As far as toys - i'd release 2 series of them. 1 a mass release plastic aimed at kids. A 2nd being for collectors. The "ENTIRE" series with a schedule of releases (3 years worth of all the main characters). Each would be LIMITED EDITION with each one NUMBER stamped (1 of 800). And instead of selling them thru relatil - they would be AUCTIONED off in blocks (meaning individually sold, but with like 25 available at a time for bids) (do I hear EBAY as an advertising client???) - thus people would pay more for #1 and some of the early ones - and then again for some of the last ones (suppy/demand). Prices would fall in the middle - depending on how much demand and activity there was. But I bet the overall AVERAGE cost would be higher than if they sold them at set retail. Plus the whole DIFFERENCE in the way they are sold would create a buzz and be news worthy. Perhaps even work out deals with advertisers that the top 10 go to advertisers - thus the #1-#10 might go to advertisers - that they can use in various promotional ways with their products. Just some random quick ideas. Point is - the idea is marketable as well.

There won't be a reboot for a long time. Unlike most Die-hard G1 Fan, everybody else really liked the movies. Just be happy Transformers 3 will be the last Transformers Movie Bay will ever do. Then you guys can talk about how the new Director destroyed Transformers in a new way. The Best you can get any time soon is a Spin-off movie, Or Transformers 4 done by Spielberg or another new director. Transformers made waaaaaay too much money for Hasbro and Paramount for 3 to be the End. Hell, just look at Pirates of the Carribean 4, Spider-man reboot, X-men prequel. The bad new for you guys is that they will probably stick with the Bayformer design because most non Transformer Fans really like those designs.

Just look at how much money and worldwide fame the MovieVerse has made. I honestly liked the movies, and I am a G1 Purist. However I also know that the movies do not encroach upon G1 and stand on their own. Do I agree with everything in the movies? No

 

Do I think Michael Bay has done a good job with them? Yes

Do I hate the twins? Yes

 

The fact is just because you don't agree or like how they were done does not mean they were failures, it is merely your opinion but don't forget money talks :P

A lot of people loved Transformers, even non-fans. But a lot of non-fans also disliked ROTF. If you look at my criticisms against ROTF it's not coming from a Transfan POV, but just from a general audience POV. It's just the inconsistent story-telling and lack of substantial character development that made ROTF somewhat lacking to me. I felt that the movie was unnecessarily long too. A long movie can be good if it's done well, like Lord of the Rings. But I didn't feel ROTF achieved that.

 

My wife isn't a fan of Transformers in any way, shape or form -- she liked the first film but disliked the second.

 

And look, that's not to say that I totally dislike ROTF. There are elements of it that I do like (it had absolutely kick arse special effects and fight scenes for sure), but I would have enjoyed it more had the story-telling been of consistent quality. It's got nothing to do with any pre-disposed G1 bias that I might have, I put that aside when I watch the movies cos I know it's an entirely different universe. Otherwise if I wanted to strap on my G1 purst goggles, I'd complain about silly things like:

+ Why isn't Megatron a gun?!

+ Why isn't Soundwave a walkman!? (I don't care if it's obsolete technology!)

+ Why isn't Barricade a Formula-1 race car?!

+ Why isn't Blackout a jet?? I mean, half a jet?!?

+ Since when was Jolt an Autobot?!?

+ Since when was Mudflap an Autobot??

+ Why is Skids a hatchback and not a sports car? And why is he retarded instead of being a vain prick?!

+ Why isn't Ironhide a red van??

+ Aw man, I hate how Optimus Prime isn't a flat-nose and has chopper flames

+ Why isn't Ratchet an ambulance??

+ Why isn't Bumblebee a VW and Jazz a Porsche?? I don't care if they can't get the legal rights!!

+ Why is Buster/Spike/Butch called "Sam" and why is Sparkplug called "Ron"? It should be William Irving!!

+ Why is Carly called Mikaela and not blonde?? (this would be my whinge in 2007 remember)

+ Why is Chip Chase called Glen... and fat. And not crippled? And black!

+ Why is Walter Barnett called William Lennox... and younger... and white!

+ What the <expletive> is an AllSpark Cube?!?

etc etc etc.

</sarcasm> ;) :P

A lot of people loved Transformers, even non-fans. But a lot of non-fans also disliked ROTF. If you look at my criticisms against ROTF it's not coming from a Transfan POV, but just from a general audience POV. It's just the inconsistent story-telling and lack of substantial character development that made ROTF somewhat lacking to me. I felt that the movie was unnecessarily long too. A long movie can be good if it's done well, like Lord of the Rings. But I didn't feel ROTF achieved that.

 

My wife isn't a fan of Transformers in any way, shape or form -- she liked the first film but disliked the second.

 

And look, that's not to say that I totally dislike ROTF. There are elements of it that I do like (it had absolutely kick arse special effects and fight scenes for sure), but I would have enjoyed it more had the story-telling been of consistent quality. It's got nothing to do with any pre-disposed G1 bias that I might have, I put that aside when I watch the movies cos I know it's an entirely different universe. Otherwise if I wanted to strap on my G1 purst goggles, I'd complain about silly things like:

+ Why isn't Megatron a gun?!

+ Why isn't Soundwave a walkman!? (I don't care if it's obsolete technology!)

+ Why isn't Barricade a Formula-1 race car?!

+ Why isn't Blackout a jet?? I mean, half a jet?!?

+ Since when was Jolt an Autobot?!?

+ Since when was Mudflap an Autobot??

+ Why is Skids a hatchback and not a sports car? And why is he retarded instead of being a vain prick?!

+ Why isn't Ironhide a red van??

+ Aw man, I hate how Optimus Prime isn't a flat-nose and has chopper flames

+ Why isn't Ratchet an ambulance??

+ Why isn't Bumblebee a VW and Jazz a Porsche?? I don't care if they can't get the legal rights!!

+ Why is Buster/Spike/Butch called "Sam" and why is Sparkplug called "Ron"? It should be William Irving!!

+ Why is Carly called Mikaela and not blonde?? (this would be my whinge in 2007 remember)

+ Why is Chip Chase called Glen... and fat. And not crippled? And black!

+ Why is Walter Barnett called William Lennox... and younger... and white!

+ What the <expletive> is an AllSpark Cube?!?

etc etc etc.

</sarcasm> ;) :P

 

I'll give you that the story for ROTF sucked, I agree with you there. But for the Action it was awesome the problem is it was rushed and they tried to cram in too much. Best way to view it as a Transformers fan is to stop thinking it is G1 cause it is not.

I still hate the idea of the allspark cube and remember the arguments that caused across the net because of a certain other site.

 

But money is still the biggest talker, and fact maker

Best way to view it as a Transformers fan is to stop thinking it is G1 cause it is not.

I don't understand why fans (not just TF fans) have a hard time accepting new revisions of old favorites. I like things when they have some variety. A good example is "GI Joe: Renegades." I love seeing the GI Joe franchise totally reimagined like that.

 

An example of how things can get boring, IMO, is the "Spectacular Spider-Man" series. How many times do we have to see origin stories of those villains? That's why I liked "Spider-Man Unlimited." It was totally new and fresh idea with Spidey.

 

Pretty much most are into nostalgia, I watched a few episodes of GI Joe renegades, and I love the new take on it, certain character designs weren't good. But the story is amazing. Wish I could watch more of it. As for Spider-Man, in the last 10 years I have only seen the movies. The rest is boring.

 

But Transformers is very diverse, Everyone has their likes and dislikes it keeps the Franchise as a powerful player

But money is still the biggest talker, and fact maker

Business over art FTL. :(

The best movies are the ones that are enjoyable to watch repeatedly AND makes lots of money; movie makers are happy, fans are happy.

 

e.g.:

 

I don't understand why fans (not just TF fans) have a hard time accepting new revisions of old favorites. I like things when they have some variety.

Some people just fear change and anything that's different. Remember in 1996-97 with all the "TRUKK NOT MUNKY!" people rampaging around the internets? Back then those of us who supported Beast Wars had to vehemently fight and debate to defend it -- in fact, there was an online group called BWADL -- Beast Wars Anti Defamation League. It didn't last very long as Beast Wars very quickly picked up steam and soon most fans were on board. :)

all men, of all ages love cars.

 

Yeah well...You'd be wrong...

 

I love TRAINS. I don't give 2 shits about cars