If soundwaves only claim to fame is being "The Tapedeck Guy". Then he is doomed.

All in all, everyone who has posted have valid points, but i still don't understand peoples opinion of a tapedeck Soundwave not being too believable for a film about GIANT ROBOTS FROM SPACE, it is after all a make believe film, why do we have to take things too serious.

It's not entirely about believability (for me). It's about seeing something cool on screen and seeing the characters given due respect. We've seen a portable radio Transformer in live action once now, and it was cool...but making Soundwave the same thing in the sequel makes him "Sloppy Seconds Frenzy" (which should, by the way, be the name of a FAB toy) to the G.A. and he deserves better than that.

 

It's similar to how this first movie handled Ironhide and Ratchet...Hasbro just assigned names to preexisting toys when they developed the line back in the 80s. But it so happened that the two "van" characters developed into very distinct, fan favorite characters. When the filmmakers decided to drop Arcee in favor of Ironhide, they didn't say "they were repaints of each other in G1, let's just recolor this Ratchet model, take the sirens off, and save a few bucks."

 

Instead they built a new robot model for Ironhide from the ground up, with a new Alt. Mode, and gave the two characters not only the respect they deserved to be shown by treating them as true individuals, but gave the audience some visual variety which made the film that much more exciting.

 

I don't see how Soundwave deserves any less.

 

 

i see your point, but ironhide and racthet are no where as iconic and recognizable to the G.A. as soundwave is.

Which brings me back to:

 

This "movie for a broad audience, not Transformers fans" argument was the one used by the filmmakers for more than a whole year as to why things would be changing from the cartoon to the first film. The film's success shows that their formula of change worked for that same broad audience. Time for more change, me thinks.

 

The filmmakers aren't the least bit concerned about the iconic impact of any character (beyond probably Prime) on the G.A. because if the G.A. could be drawn to the film based on iconic impact alone, they'd be part of the fandom already.

 

The G.A. wants new and improved, period.

Frenzy was originally going to be Soundwave[/b]. The whole reason why they changed it was because not having the character mass convert didn't work for Soundwave. People wouldn' ahve accepted him as Soundwave. Soundwave had to be able to mass convert or it wouldn't work. For another character, it works fine, but "Soundwave" has to mass shift. That was why they didn't use the name for the character in the end, and went with Frenzy instead. They specifically stated as much�€†"A: SOUNDWAVE is still in the script but he might be put off until the next movie since currently having him as a CD and not mass-shifting could make it seem really strange for a lot of people."

 

The reason why they called the character that was going to be Soundwave "Frenzy" instead is because they wanted Soundwave to mass shift, and mass shifting was not being used in the first movie. Tie that into the later statement about them wanting to take the time to get Soundwave's character right, as well as Hasbro's insistance that Soundwave mass convert, and it is clear that they consider Mass conversiuon an integral part of Soundwave's character. It is a part of what makes Soundwave who he is.

 

 

THe "whole reason they changed it" is because people wouldn't accept him as a whirring clicking comedy character. The quote can be read with out magic shrinky fever too. "since currently having him as a CD and not mass-shifting could make it seem really strange for a lot of people" As in we wanted a cd character, but we don't want mass shifting, but we don't want sound wave to be a mini bot. I read that as proof that there will be no mass shifting sound wave or no, and those two statements you love to tie together, had nothing to do with each other. Now that doesn't mean your interpritation is wrong, but it does mean you should stop saying that the producers are on your side like you have the hotline to god.

 

As for mass shifting being and integral part of his character. ONLY TO YOU.

No, not only to me. Also to Hasbro, or did you overlook Murphy's statement about Hasbro all but demanding that Soundwave Mass shift? The intent of the statement about Soundwave being a CD and not mass shifting is clearly an indicator that Soundwave can't be a CD player without mass shifting, and, given that his most iconic form, the one most people remember is his tapedeck mode, to do Soundwave justice means he has to be a Stereo CD player, and he has to mass convert.

No, not only to me. Also to Hasbro, or did you overlook Murphy's statement about Hasbro all but demanding that Soundwave Mass shift?

 

Did you overlook the complete lack of Mass Shifting new Soundwave toys Hasbro has made since G1? If it means that much to them, why would they ever make a non-mass shifting alt. mode Soundwave?

 

Me thinks Mr. Murphy was blowing smoke.

No, not only to me. Also to Hasbro, or did you overlook Murphy's statement about Hasbro all but demanding that Soundwave Mass shift? The intent of the statement about Soundwave being a CD and not mass shifting is clearly an indicator that Soundwave can't be a CD player without mass shifting, and, given that his most iconic form, the one most people remember is his tapedeck mode, to do Soundwave justice means he has to be a Stereo CD player, and he has to mass convert.

 

Except there has been no mass converting since 1986 and I don't see Bay with his flames and Prime Lips being the one to break that trend.

 

Jazz dosn't play Jazz, Bumblebee ain't even a bug anymore. Soundwave is just a name.

 

 

I don't remember Soundwave being a CD player. Don't seem to ICONIC to me,

All in all, everyone who has posted have valid points, but i still don't understand peoples opinion of a tapedeck Soundwave not being too believable for a film about GIANT ROBOTS FROM SPACE, it is after all a make believe film, why do we have to take things too serious.

It's not entirely about believability (for me). It's about seeing something cool on screen and seeing the characters given due respect. We've seen a portable radio Transformer in live action once now, and it was cool...but making Soundwave the same thing in the sequel makes him "Sloppy Seconds Frenzy" (which should, by the way, be the name of a FAB toy) to the G.A. and he deserves better than that.

 

It's similar to how this first movie handled Ironhide and Ratchet...Hasbro just assigned names to preexisting toys when they developed the line back in the 80s. But it so happened that the two "van" characters developed into very distinct, fan favorite characters. When the filmmakers decided to drop Arcee in favor of Ironhide, they didn't say "they were repaints of each other in G1, let's just recolor this Ratchet model, take the sirens off, and save a few bucks."

 

Instead they built a new robot model for Ironhide from the ground up, with a new Alt. Mode, and gave the two characters not only the respect they deserved to be shown by treating them as true individuals, but gave the audience some visual variety which made the film that much more exciting.

 

I don't see how Soundwave deserves any less.

 

 

i see your point, but ironhide and racthet are no where as iconic and recognizable to the G.A. as soundwave is.

Which brings me back to:

 

This "movie for a broad audience, not Transformers fans" argument was the one used by the filmmakers for more than a whole year as to why things would be changing from the cartoon to the first film. The film's success shows that their formula of change worked for that same broad audience. Time for more change, me thinks.

 

The filmmakers aren't the least bit concerned about the iconic impact of any character (beyond probably Prime) on the G.A. because if the G.A. could be drawn to the film based on iconic impact alone, they'd be part of the fandom already.

 

The G.A. wants new and improved, period.

New and improved huh? Let me guess, you prefer the prequel SW trilogy to the Original?

 

This brings me back to an earlier post i made about these movies being G1 inspired to hook us fans and to hook up the G.A. who may remember the "red truck robot" and the "tape deck" guy. General Audiences are not clamoring for "new and improved." I have yet to run into someone on the street, at work, at the gym or at the barbershop who has stated to me that "they want new and improved Transformers on the big screen." G.A. will watch and enjoy anything thrown at them as long as its entertaining. Hell G.A. enjoy movies that are not entertaining as well (Spider-Man 3 anyone??). No one is taking to the streets demanding for new and improved transformers. The General Audience could care less about whats being shown on screen as long as its entertaining and worth the ticket of admission. The first film had enough references to make the fans happy, and enough appeal to make the G.A. happy. I don't think the inclusion of a tapedeck Soundwave is going to turn off the G.A. from wathcing the film so long as it exceeds the first film in action and excitement.

 

Still looking for a member of the G.A. to tell me that they want new and improved.......nope can't find them.

New and improved huh? Let me guess, you prefer the prequel SW trilogy to the Original?

 

A) I'm not the G.A. Hello, Transformers Fan Board membership.

 

B) The prequel trilogy is new, but not improved.

 

Which pretty much addresses the rest of your post. Bottom line is: if the G.A. is happy with the status quo of the franchise, why hasn't every Transformer show drawn the kind of audience the movie has?

 

Because they required change in the franchise to get excited about it again. The same old same old didn't cut it for them.

No, not only to me. Also to Hasbro, or did you overlook Murphy's statement about Hasbro all but demanding that Soundwave Mass shift? The intent of the statement about Soundwave being a CD and not mass shifting is clearly an indicator that Soundwave can't be a CD player without mass shifting, and, given that his most iconic form, the one most people remember is his tapedeck mode, to do Soundwave justice means he has to be a Stereo CD player, and he has to mass convert.

 

Except there has been no mass converting since 1986 and I don't see Bay with his flames and Prime Lips being the one to break that trend.

 

Jazz dosn't play Jazz, Bumblebee ain't even a bug anymore. Soundwave is just a name.

 

 

I don't remember Soundwave being a CD player. Don't seem to ICONIC to me,

Actually, yes, there has been mass convertring transformations since G1. In fact, there has been quite a bit including in the latest TransFormers cartoon Cybertron. Jolt, Sixspeed and Reverb all mass convert so that they can carry humans inside their cockpits in vehicle mode. They go from robots that stand no taller than seven feet, to full-sized vehicles in excess of 12 feet long or more. That is mass conversion. Starscream grows to the same size as Primus, and in at least one instance makes his hand grow to enormous size just by willing it. Mass conversion is just as prevelant as it ever was.

 

Jazz never played Jazz to begin with. He was simply hip and cool and had an innate understanding of othe cultures, and could assimilate well. He also loved good music of a wide variety. He was "jazzy", hence the name Jazz. Movie Jazz is just as into Earth culture, and Assimilates just as well. He is simply modernized instead of trapped in the '80s. Movie Bumblebee is still a yellow and black car, and still has the same personality. The make and model of the car is not as important as the color and personality to that character. Optimus Prime still has all of his iconic traits. He still has his face plate, even though he only wears it in battle. He still has whindshields for a chest, and his grill still forms his abdomen. He is still red and blue, and still transforms into a semi cab.

 

As for Soundwave, Tape Decks are no longer prevalent. They're pretty much obsolete. Their modern counterpart is the CD player. Therefore, to update Soundwave, you have to go from an old fashoned tape deck to a CD player. That is updating while still keeping the essense of his iconic alternate mode and appearance.

New and improved huh? Let me guess, you prefer the prequel SW trilogy to the Original?

 

A) I'm not the G.A. Hello, Transformers Fan Board membership.

 

B) The prequel trilogy is new, but not improved.

 

Which pretty much addresses the rest of your post. Bottom line is: if the G.A. is happy with the status quo of the franchise, why hasn't every Transformer show drawn the kind of audience the movie has?

 

Because they required change in the franchise to get excited about it again. The same old same old didn't cut it for them.

 

The general audience probably did not even know about AEC existing! To most of the general audiences, their memories of Transformers was the original series. They went into watching the film remembering G1 and the characters of G1. I don't remember seeing people in the audience in the movie theater asking when Alpha Q or Vector Prime were going to make their appearances. sorry, but G.A are not the driving force of success and failure of a tv series. hell, Family Guy was brought back to the airwaves from cancellation because of the fans, not the G.A. who ignored how good of a show it actually was. Remember, just because we are TFans and know all the ins and outs of our hobby, does not mean the general audiences are going to know about Armada or Energon or Cybertron.

 

With having a show air at 5 or 6am, it is going to be hard to gain an Audience, general or not. Hell i am a tfan and never watched any of the AEC shows because of the damn timeslots were all over the place...but that aside, these shows just as the Prequel trilogy were new and yes were not an improvement at all. I have no problem with change. i love what the filmmakers did with Ironhide and Ratchet. I just think, as i have stated a number of times already, that Soundwaves look and gimmick (tapedeck man!) is too iconic for the filmmakers to change for the sake of changing. if they are going to have the Soundwave character in there, then they should have all his characteristics in there as well. If not, then he will just be SWINO.

Actually, yes, there has been mass convertring transformations since G1. In fact, there has been quite a bit including in the latest TransFormers cartoon Cybertron.

 

Just not any in the 4 (5 including Animated, 6 including Beast Wars) characters named Soundwave since G1 ended...even though it's so important to Hasbro.

 

The general audience probably did not even know about AEC existing! To most of the general audiences, their memories of Transformers was the original series. They went into watching the film remembering G1 and the characters of G1. I don't remember seeing people in the audience in the movie theater asking when Alpha Q or Vector Prime were going to make their appearances. sorry, but G.A are not the driving force of success and failure of a tv series. Remember, just because we are TFans and know all the ins and outs of our hobby, does not mean the general audiences are going to know about Armada or Energon or Cybertron.

 

With having a show air at 5 or 6am, it is going to be hard to gain an Audience, general or not. Hell i am a tfan and never watched any of the AEC shows because of the damn timeslots were all over the place...but that aside, these shows just as the Prequel trilogy were new and yes were not an improvement at all. I have no problem with change. i love what the filmmakers did with Ironhide and Ratchet. I just think, as i have stated a number of times already, that Soundwaves look and gimmick (tapedeck man!) is too iconic for the filmmakers to change for the sake of changing. if they are going to have the Soundwave character in there, then they should have all his characteristics in there as well. If not, then he will just be SWINO.

 

You lose for use of the Angry Fan "In Name Only" designation.

 

And yes, the G.A. would know about A/E/C if they were already fans...but that side-steps the point that the G.A. would be fans if the status quo of Transformers was enough to draw them in to it. But it isn't and they weren't.

 

You're suggesting that when "24" debuted, it had no chance to draw in an audience unless people were already fans of real time counter-terrorist action and follow the genre on message boards and stuff. I'm saying that if it's good enough, the audience will come to it, regardless.