Oh no.... it's the dreaded "G1 vs. everything else" debate!! :eek2

 

I just wanted to say that we should not confuse financial success with quality. Sure, Armada paved the way cash-wise for everything since, but it was still crap. I'm grateful for the fact that it made Hasbro enough money to continue developing Transformers, but I don't feel some debt of gratitude to the character designs or the cartoon. :tfpuke

 

And speaking as a G1 fan, I have to say that every day G1 just looks older and more tired. For instance, I think Energon Starscream is way cooler than G1 Starscream. The old figures just seem kinda... well, old. Perhaps the Alternators also had something to do with it.

 

Finally, I'd like to say:

MEGATRON RULES!

:tflaugh

G1 gave hasbro the chance to experiment and introduce ome of the best elements in today's toys. You know for example

 

Headmasters - (E-Omega Supreme, Armada Overload)

Targetmasters - (Minicons)

Powermasters - (again Minicons)

Gestalts - (Powerlinx)

Factions(Insecticons, Protectobots,etc.)

Micromasters - (Once again the Minicons)

Beast modes - G1 brought first the beast modes, BW improved them.

Actionmasters - (Kicker, atransformers toy that does not transform.)

Pretenders..and the list colud go on.

We can see these concepts in today's toys. Instead of creating new ideas they are recycling older concepts, only add a couple gimmicks, better articulation and thats it.

 

So you see, thre's alot of G1 influence in todays generation of transformers, and it go on and on.

G1 gave hasbro the chance to experiment and introduce ome of the best elements in today's toys. You know for example

 

Headmasters - (E-Omega Supreme, Armada Overload)

Targetmasters - (Minicons)

Powermasters - (again Minicons)

Gestalts - (Powerlinx)

Factions(Insecticons, Protectobots,etc.)

Micromasters - (Once again the Minicons)

Beast modes - G1 brought first the beast modes, BW improved them.

Actionmasters - (Kicker, atransformers toy that does not transform.)

Pretenders..and the list colud go on.

We can see these concepts in today's toys. Instead of creating new ideas they are recycling older concepts, only add a couple gimmicks, better articulation and thats it.

 

So you see, thre's alot of G1 influence in todays generation of transformers, and it go on and on.

Some of these are *really* clutching at straws, man...

 

 

Headmasters - (E-Omega Supreme, Armada Overload)

 

Given.

 

Targetmasters - (Minicons)

 

Cept The Air Military and Emergency teams, dont, yanno... suck. Whoo! I fold in half and shoot lasers from my nono! :nuts

 

Powermasters - (again Minicons)

 

Stretch. I'll grant it due to Blurr's transformation

 

Gestalts - (Powerlinx)

 

See also: Virtually any mecha anime since the 70s.

 

Factions(Insecticons, Protectobots,etc.)

 

They're subgroups. Only Autobot and Decepticon are factions. However, nitpicking aside... none of the groups today are anywhere near so "focused".

 

Micromasters - (Once again the Minicons)

 

Granted.

 

Beast modes - G1 brought first the beast modes, BW improved them.

 

Stretch. The G1 animals were definately robotic... BW was all about realistic looking, and then cybernetic, beasts.

 

Actionmasters - (Kicker, atransformers toy that does not transform.)

 

.... just no. Not even close. The only Hasbro product Kicker is close to is a GI Joe or an SW figure. He's a human, not a TF that doesn't transform.

 

Pretenders..and the list colud go on.

 

And where are there Pretenders in any modern TF series?

My concensus is that G1 really is overated.  Sure, it brings many people fond memories, but in comparison with what we have now, the storytelling was primitive, the toys were fragile and less fun to actually play with, and like Bodycount, I feel that it's more nostalgia than anything that fuels people's love for G1, rather than anything of truly high calibur.

Aside from some killer alt modes the first two years. :) Mario Sunshine is so much better than SMB on NES. Wonder why.

 

Nostalgic fueled love isn't so bad, as long as it doesn't confuse the present.

I don't post here much, so excuse my lack of etiquette.

 

Transformers, as I recall, are supposed to be "Robots in Disguise", right? Well, I think the reason most people view G1 and Beast Wars as the best lines, other than the nostalgia for G1, is that they were just that, robots in disguise. the majority of them looked like real world items, (cars, tapes, beasts) and also turned into robots. Where in the world do you see vehicles, beasts, and other items like you do in Armada? Or Energon? Or even G2? Sure, when the later eps. of G1 came out, after the movie, they went with that futuristic car look, and personally, I think that's where Hasbro went wrong. At least the colors weren't as bad as some of the Armada stuff, or even Universe line. Even in Beast Wars, towards the end, the went a little crazy with all of the transmetal stuff and fuzors. but at least Megatron looked like a dragon. Most of the Armada toys look like, I don't know, just ugly. Even the everyday cars in Armada don't look like the cars the Transformers are suppose to blend into. "Oh look, that car looks a Nissan. But that one? I think there's something wrong with it...it looks like a Hyundai on crack...." Yeah, way to blend in. I don't even want to talk about that mess of a figure they call Energon Omega Supreme. :tfpuke It looks like Hasbro has a bunch of color blind chimps with the shakes coloring these things.

 

Yes, these toys are for children, but so were the G1 toys and Beast Wars and even RID. They were just made with better thinking and quality in mind. I think G2 went with the flash and cash over substance that eventually put the final nail in the coffin for the TF line of that era...or wait...was that the Action Masters...? Again, quick buck kills quality. It like saying the majority of pop music is comparable to Beethoven because it sold a ton or records. If it's crap, it's crap, regardless of how much money it makes. It just shows the majority of consumers are mindless drones willing to spend on whatever is popular, regardless of the obvious lack of quality...but I digress...

 

The real issue here is the G1 vs. everything else. I think G1 with Beast Wars, and most of the RID line bring out the true ideas behind the TF toy lines. All 3 of these lines were made with a great attention to quality and detail. I mean the toys, not the cartoons. Ha ha, some most of those were just funny on some of the things they did. Except for Beast Wars. I think that did alot for the TF mythos. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it....

G1 gave hasbro the chance to experiment and introduce ome of the best elements in today's toys. You know for example

 

Headmasters - (E-Omega Supreme, Armada Overload)

Targetmasters - (Minicons)

Powermasters - (again Minicons)

Gestalts - (Powerlinx)

Factions(Insecticons, Protectobots,etc.)

Micromasters - (Once again the Minicons)

Beast modes - G1 brought first the beast modes, BW improved them.

Actionmasters - (Kicker, atransformers toy that does not transform.)

Pretenders..and the list colud go on.

We can see these concepts in today's toys. Instead of creating new ideas they are recycling older concepts, only add a couple gimmicks, better articulation and thats it.

 

So you see, thre's alot of G1 influence in todays generation of transformers, and it go on and on.

I might disagree about some of the details, but I do agree with your main point. While it's cool to see "updated" versions of classic G1 characters, I wonder if things are stagnating a bit creatively. Personally, I'd love to see more figures like Energon Mirage, and less like Energon Rodimus. Nothing against the figures -- I think most of them are cool -- but I would hate to see the Transformers get stuck in a creative rut. But I guess as long as they continue to strike a good balance between homages and new figures, I think it'll be okay.

The real issue here is the G1 vs. everything else. I think G1 with Beast Wars, and most of the RID line bring out the true ideas behind the TF toy lines. All 3 of these lines were made with a great attention to quality and detail. I mean the toys, not the cartoons. Ha ha, some most of those were just funny on some of the things they did. Except for Beast Wars. I think that did alot for the TF mythos. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it....

Again, I may not be with you on all the details, but I do agree with your main point. While it's cool to see futuristic or Cybertronian or whatever alt modes, many times it's been used as an excuse for laziness in design. After all, if you're making up the alt mode, who's to say what it's supposed to look like?

 

The RiD car brothers are three of my favorite TFs. And of course the Alternators are fantastic. I'm not so hip on the BW toys just b/c the whole idea is a bit icky, but at least they stayed with the same basic idea of Transformers "disguising" themselves. After all, if there's no need for disguise, why do they even need to transform in the first place? Why don't they just *drive* a car, instead of turning into one, you know?

I don't post here much, so excuse my lack of etiquette.

 

Transformers, as I recall, are supposed to be "Robots in Disguise", right? Well, I think the reason most people view G1 and Beast Wars as the best lines, other than the nostalgia for G1, is that they were just that, robots in disguise. the majority of them looked like real world items, (cars, tapes, beasts) and also turned into robots. Where in the world do you see vehicles, beasts, and other items like you do in Armada? Or Energon? Or even G2? Sure, when the later eps. of G1 came out, after the movie, they went with that futuristic car look, and personally, I think that's where Hasbro went wrong. At least the colors weren't as bad as some of the Armada stuff, or even Universe line. Even in Beast Wars, towards the end, the went a little crazy with all of the transmetal stuff and fuzors. but at least Megatron looked like a dragon. Most of the Armada toys look like, I don't know, just ugly. Even the everyday cars in Armada don't look like the cars the Transformers are suppose to blend into. "Oh look, that car looks a Nissan. But that one? I think there's something wrong with it...it looks like a Hyundai on crack...." Yeah, way to blend in. I don't even want to talk about that mess of a figure they call Energon Omega Supreme. :tfpuke It looks like Hasbro has a bunch of color blind chimps with the shakes coloring these things.

 

Yes, these toys are for children, but so were the G1 toys and Beast Wars and even RID. They were just made with better thinking and quality in mind. I think G2 went with the flash and cash over substance that eventually put the final nail in the coffin for the TF line of that era...or wait...was that the Action Masters...? Again, quick buck kills quality. It like saying the majority of pop music is comparable to Beethoven because it sold a ton or records. If it's crap, it's crap, regardless of how much money it makes. It just shows the majority of consumers are mindless drones willing to spend on whatever is popular, regardless of the obvious lack of quality...but I digress...

 

The real issue here is the G1 vs. everything else. I think G1 with Beast Wars, and most of the RID line bring out the true ideas behind the TF toy lines. All 3 of these lines were made with a great attention to quality and detail. I mean the toys, not the cartoons. Ha ha, some most of those were just funny on some of the things they did. Except for Beast Wars. I think that did alot for the TF mythos. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it....

You talk like you understand the entire design and liscensing process, but you don't. Armada and Energon are the best toyline and the most successful, so just get over it. Your G1 is TIRED. Let it pass already. It's insulting, and your opinions are also insulting to Hasbro's employees who invest pretty much their LIFE in these projects.

And another thing I'm seeing here in this post is just a load of message board newbs stroking G1's stuff. I understand that you're new here and you're completely uneducated on the fandom and new products because you're pissed that you aren't 9 anymore, but give it a rest. We don't care what you like, and we don't care to hear you talk about how crappy everything is because its not what you want.

Find a new opinion.

The real issue here is the G1 vs. everything else. I think G1 with Beast Wars, and most of the RID line bring out the true ideas behind the TF toy lines. All 3 of these lines were made with a great attention to quality and detail. I mean the toys, not the cartoons. Ha ha, some most of those were just funny on some of the things they did. Except for Beast Wars. I think that did alot for the TF mythos. That's  my opinion, and I'm sticking to it....

Again, I may not be with you on all the details, but I do agree with your main point. While it's cool to see futuristic or Cybertronian or whatever alt modes, many times it's been used as an excuse for laziness in design. After all, if you're making up the alt mode, who's to say what it's supposed to look like?

 

The RiD car brothers are three of my favorite TFs. And of course the Alternators are fantastic. I'm not so hip on the BW toys just b/c the whole idea is a bit icky, but at least they stayed with the same basic idea of Transformers "disguising" themselves. After all, if there's no need for disguise, why do they even need to transform in the first place? Why don't they just *drive* a car, instead of turning into one, you know?

I do agree with you that the Alternators are fantastic. Great attention to detail, and exactly, in my opinion, what the true essence of TF's are, robots in disguise. that's also why I enjoyed the RID line so much. The show was geared to a younger audience, but I think the toys were top notch. Goes to show you don't need Die-cast metal. I wasn't too keen on the whole Beast Wars idea either at first. I mean, animals? Huh? But then when you look at the toys and see how well desiged a majority of them were, you say, "Wow, it took alot of thought to get that stuff hidden and make it look like that." Couple that with a really good storyline that really showed the need for those types of alt modes, then you can appreciate the work behind it and the final product.

 

I think it's great you like G2 (obviously from your sig), and you mention why. The over-the-topness of the whole line may appeal to some, but not all. I thought it was too much, and that's why I stopped buying them. At least though, G2 still had some of those realistic car modes in them, unlike the post movie toys. I think the Megatron Rules sticker was funny as hell, which is why he and Optimus were the only 2 I bought!