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GEE, so you must of not liked Macross, Southern Calvary, and Mospeada-AKA Robotech then did you?

 

Silly rabbits, G1 Blast Off and Vortex were the first TFs to have ball joints.

 

He's on crack! just kidding! those figures only had a limited amount of ball joints, not a complete figure... but then again there was a little signs of the ball joint system in most of the combiner teams- except BrickKing aka Predaking!

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Do not watch any Japanese shows aside from Medabots. Mostly because it is not aired here but even if it was I probably still would not watch it.

 

I just do not care for the animation style used in Anime and seeing how animation in a cartoon is an important aspect that makes it hard to get into.

 

And as I have seen it, the Japanese have had their chance to prove their skills when they "took over" the Transformers series with Headmasters and later with Armada and Energon.

 

Seeing how those shows (in my opinion) did not live up to the US shows, I must conclude to myself that anime is not for me so I do not watch it. Barely got time to watch the shows that I do like so I am not going to try something new that I may or may not like.

 

Something has to appeal to you or you will not like it. I mean Charlie Chaplin is still considered a genius but does anyone think he is really funny? It is all about target audience.

 

The Japanese just have a whole different view on what makes a good Transformers cartoon. And if you do not like their style then their Transformers cartoons just do not cut it.

 

They for instance idolize humans whereas I can hardly stand them. Any US fans dislike the humans in TF cartoons while the Japanese writers seem intent on including them as much as possible.

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*trim*

 

Seeing how those shows (in my opinion) did not live up to the US shows, I must conclude to myself that anime is not for me so I do not watch it. Barely got time to watch the shows that I do like so I am not going to try something new that I may or may not like.

 

Something has to appeal to you or you will not like it. I mean Charlie Chaplin is still considered a genius but does anyone think he is really funny? It is all about target audience.

 

*trim*

 

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WOAH?! What the Hell are you talking about?!?!

Truely your ignorance knows no bounds....

 

Have you even watched any Chaplin films??

or wait aminute - you dont have time for anything that you might or might not like....

 

So the only thing you are intersted in is the exact same thing you saw last week and never any deviation from your limited definition of quality....

 

This is like saying that Smurfs sucked so all american animation must eqqually suck... therefrore there is no reason to watch Shrek cause its obviously just like the smurfs...

 

Wow my head almost just exploded...

But then i dont feel well today

 

Hunter

Ok, in retrospect that did sound a little "odd" (for lack of better words).

 

I recently watched a documentary or actually a lecture about comedy that stated that Chaplin allthough still considered a genius is losing his appeal. I mean what was funny 10 years ago may not be funny today as people's interests keep changing.

 

I saw several Chaplin clips as well as other clips from those era's and it just did not appeal to me. I can surely see why people then liked it and that those people still like it also makes sense but I doubt many yonger people would.

 

I cannot explain it as well as that lecture did but it did make a lot of sense to me.

 

The same applies for the G1 cartoon, back in its day it still was not perfect but it was excellent as a children's cartoon show whereas today it would be a huge failure.

 

And I am not saying that I do not like to watch anything different. My favorite Star Trek show is Deep Space Nine because it is different but it is still Star Trek at heart. (Heck the original Star Trek series would not really work in the current era but is still a classic if there is any.)

 

However, and this may sound strange, but when I look at the Japanese Transformers show they do not have that what makes Transformers so great. They lack the really interesting characters and humor I came to expect from Beast Wars. Even the sillyness from R.I.D. is missing.

 

That show was still quite good actually because it did not take itself too seriously.

 

However the latest Transformers shows seem content on having storylines that run trough every episode requiring people to watch all of them, involving humans into everything and combat is based more on super modes and special attacks than on fighting as was the case in Beast Wars.

 

And I have seen a few other anime shows such as Dragonball Z or Yu-Gi-Oh and I just cannot get into that. It is just too different from the cartoons that I am used to.

 

For your information, as a kid I rather liked the Smurfs. It is a neat cartoon, especially for kids. And it did not have any violence in it, something that cannot be said for most cartoons nowadays.

There were simplistic transformations then just as there are today and always have been.

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I don't think it's soley about the simplicity.

 

Using this guy as an example, it literally looks like a big cat stood on it's hind legs.

That's not a transformation, it's just articulation.

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That's a terrible example.  There's more to transforming BM Cheetor than that pic makes you believe.  It would also help as Edgewise and I pointed out that you use a BW toy, not BM.

 

Now THIS particular Transformer looks like you just stand him up as well.  BUT, there's more to it than meets the eye.  Just like BM Cheetor here.

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It was an example of a toy from that era and BM was a continuation of BW. There are dfifferences but not some huge radical change; I own a couple from both lines and they are clearly from the same school of design.

 

And I accept what's said about BM cheetor.

But no matter how you dress it up, getting fat is not a transformation. ;)

 

Now yes, Prime looks just like a truck stood up.

That to me is impressive as trucks aren't usually capable of standing, or moving at all on their own, but organic creatures are known for it, making it less impressive.

 

In the end for me it's not even about simplicity, that was just a reference to someone elses post.

 

It's about the design style.

 

I like Shockwave.

I like that his hand is a gun.

I like that that is a part of him and had nothing at all to do with his alt mode.

 

I don't like when appendages are dictated by the alt mode.

Clawed hands, clawed feet, T-Rex heads, ridiculously long Dragon or tail hands that make it impossible to stand with arms down, or kibble such as giant lion heads that are stuck to a shoulder and make it look as though it's a permanent struggle just to stand straight.

Alt modes are supposed to compliment a bot mode, not limit it.

 

It's just a design style I do not like.

 

Also, I'm not really a fan of organic looking robots.

Alt modes, yeah, robots no.

I really would rather have shell formers or whatever you call them in that case.

There were very few stale charachters in G1, most of them were unique with a personality.

One of G1's problems was there were simply too many characters - to the point that they began recycling them, e.g. Sunstreaker and Tracks were essentially the same character. 

 

 

They were both arrogant yes but hardly the same, Sunstreaker never had a show where he was helping out humans for an entire episode, thats like saying bumblebee and wheelie were the same because they were both small and hung out with the humans a lot.

 

 

If G1 was so unappealing, why did BW have to copy several of there names?

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Hasbro's just lazy.

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Im sure thats part of it, or it could be that not many people would be interested in watching a new transformers show without the old favorites that a certain name would bring up there recognition of, like say an optimus prime. 

Hasbro's just lazy.

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Im sure thats part of it, or it could be that not many people would be interested in watching a new transformers show without the old favorites that a certain name would bring up there recognition of, like say an optimus prime. 

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I'd say this is a valid arguement for why they now always name the leaders Optimus and Megatron.

 

However, in 1995, the intented target audience (kids) likely had no idea of who or what these names represented. I serious doubt if they were targeting high-school aged and older former G1-fans as an audience (not a demographic known at the time for buying toys and watching Saturday morning cartoons).  Therefore, I'd say the names were intended more as homage (especially with the play on words of Optimus "Primal") for any old fans who happened to tune in to the show.  People have to remember, at this time, for all intents and purposes, the Transformers were dead.  Beast Wars was Hasbro's way kicking the corpse one last time.  Fortunately, this shocked the brand back to life.

Beast Wars  :tflaugh

 

Seriously though I knew next to nothing about it a year ago and was only brought into collecting with the Armada wave. Since then I have gone seriously out of my way to figure out why Beastwars and Beastmachines was so highly appreciated. Even if it meant digging out ancient BWs tapes out of the bargain bin at Superstore or going out on a limb and purchasing any of the horrid Universe repaints. Shortly after purchasing the vids (4 of them) YTV ran the whole series over the course of the Summer. Though it took a little ambition to stick with it in the beginning because of the ancient CGI it surprisingly took no time whatsoever to get into and really enjoy.

 

From the get go it was strange hearing Gary Chalk voice a Gorrilla, and Kaye a Trex but in time I could easily look past it. It was not so much the Prime is a Monkey, Megs is a Trex mentality nor did it even matter that they were. Prime and Megs were simply awsome characters altogether lightyears ahead of any incarnation now or then. This is also one of the first Transformers series where all the characters are either likable or enjoyable for one reason or another. In the beginning I personally hated both Ratrap, and Dinobot and now after seeing the whole series I have no idea why. Ratrap and Dinobot are the first two I intend to pick up when I see them on shelves.  :thumb

 

For those of you who don't get Beastwars my only advice is give it a try before you shoot it down. At least if you've seen it and still don't get it you have an excuse. I for one have considered myself somewhat evolved as a collector over the past year because of. Armada and Energon never gave us much in the line of the beastformers and I couldn't have cared less which is why I skipped the Armada Beastwars repaints.  :tard Now though with Cybertron I have gotten Scourge, Snarl, and Undermine and despite what some people think I really like them, and think each is awsome and eagerly await more beastformers in Cybertron as well as newer lines. Though I still love having G1 esgue alt modes variety IMPO makes lines what they are.

 

Lastly I want to just comment on the simple vs complex transformation debate. I just don't get you people. G1 wasn't overly complicated for the most part and I personally prefer the new lines having simpler transformations, with added articulation. Less to go wrong/break when playing with, and never frustrating. Rid is nice to look at but to fragile/flimsy to play with. For those of you who like rubics cube transformations there's the alt/binaltech lines. Grimlock took me about 45 minutes to transform properly though now that I've done it a couple of dozen times about five minutes.  :clap

 

Speaking of fugly TFs these two are just fugging hideous. :P

 

http://www.tfu.info/1986/Decepticon/Octane/octane.htm

http://www.tfu.info/1986/Autobot/Broadside/broadside.htm

I am not even being judgemental about the "organics"

 

I just think that the original molds (ie whats being rereleased) were pretty bricktastic...

 

However - by the time the second season rolled around they had developed ball-joints and whatnot.  So we started getting molds and designs that eventually brought us back to "Car-Robots/RiD"

 

Hunter

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Have you never seen the first wave bots before? :tftongue

they had very good joints, some had problems, because of the transformation,( just like some Altanators, but they all had ball joints, that was another great point about them. :clap