Here's what I think (beware teh long post cometh):

 

Hasbro was clearly concerned about keeping the TF brand "fresh," and so they decided to shake things up in 1986 in order to avoid stagnation. At the same time, they needed to make sure that this change wouldn't backfire financially, so they created a big event (aka TF:TM) as a promotional piece to get kids interested in the new direction for the series.

 

The only major miscalculation they made was to kill off Optimus Prime. That wasn't in the original script, but Hasbro decided to "up the ante" and go for it. Little did they realize that in many ways, Optimus Prime was the heart and soul of the series. And when he died 1/3 of the way through TF:TM, the TF universe changed forever. Some guy called "Ultra Magnus," who wasn't the most charismatic guy ever, started to lead the Autobots until getting PWNED in a less than awe-inspiring way. And then at the very end of the movie, Rodimus Prime appears and the bad guys all lose and the Autobots win. Yay big happy ending.

 

Only problem is that this killed the dramatic tension that formed the premise for the show. In seasons 1 and 2, there was an understanding that these two factions were warring in exile in order to determine who would control the destiny of their home planet. After TF:TM, this dramatic tension was completely obliterated. The narration at the beginning of the first season 3 episode stated that the great war was over and the Autobots had won.

 

This could have been resolved if the writers had come up with a similarly high-stakes situation for the TFs to be fighting in. But instead they left the Autobots in control of Cybertron, and the Decepticons were relegated to some POS planet. Hardly the evenly-matched scenario of seasons 1 and 2. The problem this created is that there was no clear direction for the writers. What was Galvatron's motive? (They even had him trying to DESTROY Cybertron at one point. :tfhuh) Why do the Autobots still need a military leader? And so on.

 

There's also the fact that the third season was DRAMATICALLY different from TF:TM quality-wise. The animation and voice acting simply were not anywhere close to the movie. This may not be a fair comparison, but it wasn't helped by hiring Akom (Nelson Shin was a part-owner in this animation studio). Also, they replaced the likes of Judd Nelson, Lionel Stander, Robert Stack, and Leonard Nimoy with some of the least inspiring voices in the entire series. Rodimus Prime sounded constantly bored, Kup sounded like he was trying to squeeze out a turd, Ultra Magnus (besides having the SAME voice as Smokescreen) sounded petulant and had none of Stack's presence and gravitas, and Galvatron... well this was by far the worst offense. Leonard Nimoy OWNED that role, and I still don't know what they were thinking letting Frank Welker play Galvy like he was doing a Starscream impersonation.

 

The setting and characters were also totally different from seasons 1 and 2. Alt modes had been earth-based vehicles, and they milked that even up to the end of season 2. Come season 3, the alt modes were these wacky futuristic things that wouldn't have disguised anyone. And the characters themselves were mostly pointless and annoying. In MTMTE you got the sense that these guys were a tight-knit group who were unique individuals but shared a common sensibility and purpose. In season 3, it just turned into "Rodimus Prime and his wacky sidekicks." Each character could be described in one word. None of them were very likeable apart from the audience's memories of their characters in TF:TM. And the oh-so-very-80's color schemes were a bit shocking as well. In terms of location, they were on Cybertron or Goo (:wtf) or Charr or some other stupid rocky planet most of the time; a very different visual setting than Earth.

 

I've said this before as well, but replacing the father figure of Optimus Prime with an insecure, sarcastic teenager was a very poor choice. Rodimus Prime made you want to slap him. Did he even care about the Autobot cause? All he ever talked about was himself. (I don't remember Optimus Prime ever doing that.) Whatever happened to the selfless young warrior in TF:TM who wanted to go kick Unicron's ass? All of Hot Rod's personality got sucked out when he took the Matrix, apparently.

 

I think destron760 said it best. The show was on autopilot at that point, and it wasn't enjoyable to watch anymore. You endured it and waited for cool moments, rather than just enjoying the show as it happened.

 

I think Hasbro learned a bitter lesson from this: namely, DON'T F*CK WITH SOMETHING IF IT'S WORKING! (Although some BW fans would say that they *didn't* learn this lesson, considering the mixed reaction BM got.)

 

I'm sure I could go on for even longer, but I don't want this thread to explode. :P

Here's what I think (beware teh long post cometh):

 

Hasbro was clearly concerned about keeping the TF brand "fresh," and so they decided to shake things up in 1986 in order to avoid stagnation. At the same time, they needed to make sure that this change wouldn't backfire financially, so they created a big event (aka TF:TM) as a promotional piece to get kids interested in the new direction for the series.

 

The only major miscalculation they made was to kill off Optimus Prime. That wasn't in the original script, but Hasbro decided to "up the ante" and go for it. Little did they realize that in many ways, Optimus Prime was the heart and soul of the series. And when he died 1/3 of the way through TF:TM, the TF universe changed forever. Some guy called "Ultra Magnus," who wasn't the most charismatic guy ever, started to lead the Autobots until getting PWNED in a less than awe-inspiring way. And then at the very end of the movie, Rodimus Prime appears and the bad guys all lose and the Autobots win. Yay big happy ending.

 

Only problem is that this killed the dramatic tension that formed the premise for the show. In seasons 1 and 2, there was an understanding that these two factions were warring in exile in order to determine who would control the destiny of their home planet. After TF:TM, this dramatic tension was completely obliterated. The narration at the beginning of the first season 3 episode stated that the great war was over and the Autobots had won.

 

This could have been resolved if the writers had come up with a similarly high-stakes situation for the TFs to be fighting in. But instead they left the Autobots in control of Cybertron, and the Decepticons were relegated to some POS planet. Hardly the evenly-matched scenario of seasons 1 and 2. The problem this created is that there was no clear direction for the writers. What was Galvatron's motive? (They even had him trying to DESTROY Cybertron at one point. :tfhuh) Why do the Autobots still need a military leader? And so on.

 

There's also the fact that the third season was DRAMATICALLY different from TF:TM quality-wise. The animation and voice acting simply were not anywhere close to the movie. This may not be a fair comparison, but it wasn't helped by hiring Akom (Nelson Shin was a part-owner in this animation studio). Also, they replaced the likes of Judd Nelson, Lionel Stander, Robert Stack, and Leonard Nimoy with some of the least inspiring voices in the entire series. Rodimus Prime sounded constantly bored, Kup sounded like he was trying to squeeze out a turd, Ultra Magnus (besides having the SAME voice as Smokescreen) sounded petulant and had none of Stack's presence and gravitas, and Galvatron... well this was by far the worst offense. Leonard Nimoy OWNED that role, and I still don't know what they were thinking letting Frank Welker play Galvy like he was doing a Starscream impersonation.

 

The setting and characters were also totally different from seasons 1 and 2. Alt modes had been earth-based vehicles, and they milked that even up to the end of season 2. Come season 3, the alt modes were these wacky futuristic things that wouldn't have disguised anyone. And the characters themselves were mostly pointless and annoying. In MTMTE you got the sense that these guys were a tight-knit group who were unique individuals but shared a common sensibility and purpose. In season 3, it just turned into "Rodimus Prime and his wacky sidekicks." Each character could be described in one word. None of them were very likeable apart from the audience's memories of their characters in TF:TM. And the oh-so-very-80's color schemes were a bit shocking as well. In terms of location, they were on Cybertron or Goo (:wtf) or Charr or some other stupid rocky planet most of the time; a very different visual setting than Earth.

 

I've said this before as well, but replacing the father figure of Optimus Prime with an insecure, sarcastic teenager was a very poor choice. Rodimus Prime made you want to slap him. Did he even care about the Autobot cause? All he ever talked about was himself. (I don't remember Optimus Prime ever doing that.) Whatever happened to the selfless young warrior in TF:TM who wanted to go kick Unicron's ass? All of Hot Rod's personality got sucked out when he took the Matrix, apparently.

 

I think destron760 said it best. The show was on autopilot at that point, and it wasn't enjoyable to watch anymore. You endured it and waited for cool moments, rather than just enjoying the show as it happened.

 

I think Hasbro learned a bitter lesson from this: namely, DON'T F*CK WITH SOMETHING IF IT'S WORKING! (Although some BW fans would say that they *didn't* learn this lesson, considering the mixed reaction BM got.)

 

I'm sure I could go on for even longer, but I don't want this thread to explode. :P

While I agree with what you said, I think there are other factors as well.

 

As far as the toys go, Pretenders and Action Masters weren't exactly a good idea. Even the actual TF's themselves were getting more and more bizarre (I like the monsterbots but :wtf ) which would contribute to the lack of interest in the line.

 

Plus there's the shifting of taste. It's no secret that everything goes in cycles. TF popularity is no different. They were on top for a while, but eventually SOMETHING was going to knock them out of that spot.

 

To blame it all on the suckiness of season 3 is kind of simplistic doncha think?

lord Madhammer said:

I think Hasbro learned a bitter lesson from this: namely, DON'T F*CK WITH SOMETHING IF IT'S WORKING!

 

Did they really learn any thing?

 

"alt modes were these wacky futuristic things that wouldn't have disguised anyone. And the characters themselves were mostly pointless and annoying. In MTMTE you got the sense that these guys were a tight-knit group who were unique individuals but shared a common sensibility and purpose. In season 3, it just turned into "Rodimus Prime and his wacky sidekicks."

 

I dont see anything different now in Armada, Energeon....

 

although somehow surprisingly, its working ....

Many things could have killed G1, Bad plots, animation, poor choices, bad gimmicks, kids gettin tired and movin on to something else.

I say this...

Trends. G1 was a trend that lasted for 5-6 years. Kids get tired of trends and the go get another one. It's a cycle. If we look a t todays toys we will see the 80's again in every aspect, cept for technology being improved. Transformers werea cool trend in the 80's and faded away as all trends do. Same with other toy lines of that time.

 

And if i'm right, what we have today is the big revival of that 80's trend; which will fade away eventually as all trends do.

As far as the toys go, Pretenders and Action Masters weren't exactly a good idea. Even the actual TF's themselves were getting more and more bizarre (I like the monsterbots but :wtf ) which would contribute to the lack of interest in the line.

 

Plus there's the shifting of taste. It's no secret that everything goes in cycles. TF popularity is no different. They were on top for a while, but eventually SOMETHING was going to knock them out of that spot.

 

To blame it all on the suckiness of season 3 is kind of simplistic doncha think?

yeah but it really was the beginning of the end,

 

the whole premise of TFs was Robots in disguise, you ahd toys that were great and actually looked like things that would pass a cursory glance, after TF the movie they couldnt be bothered to invest in design and chucked out these `futuristic` lumps of plastic that looked like a day-glo mess, totally uninspired.

 

I agree something was bound to knock it off the top like all fads, you have your day on top of the heap. But it would have been easy to keep the line fresh and profitable if they actually thought about it but they didnt, they expected loyalty while providing none.

 

Funny that now Takara is returning to its profitable roots ;) what goes around comes around, lets hope we dont see crap like actionmasters and pretenders ever again

For me the death of transformers started with the movie.

 

See I didnt get to go see it, it was in theaters but my parents did not have the money to take me so I was in the dark on the story line.

Then when the cartoons come back on they have killed off most of my favorite characters and replaced them with ones like Rodimus... I mean could rodimus even start to compare to optimus prime? I think not.

 

Plus, once they made the switch to the new teams they screwed up the schedule, its like all the episodes were on on weekday mornings... how weird was that.

 

Eventually I saw the movie and I thought it was awesome, I was still pretty pissed about them killing off Optimus but then they started to bring him back there at the end. Then wham!!! no more episodes... if you look at headmasters the animation etc... is exactly the same I think it was just going to be the next season of transformers but I guess Hasbro decided not purchase that bit. So no more story line to go with our toys... And the toys got lame too, those pretender shell things were just stupid and the sparkabots etc... not exactly as cool as optimus prime and sound wave. Sure I kept my old ones and I bought some micromasters years later... The best thing they could have done was release the headmasters series in the states with all the same voice actors. The show looks pretty cool on my bootlegs but the dubbing is terrible.

 

So we got left out in the dust for TF cartoons. I traded a pillow case full of transformers and I do mean full for a castlevania nes game that can now be purchased for a whopping $10 at EB games... the pillow case of transformers would probably sell for several hundred dollars on ebay.

 

When Beast wars came around none of us had any clue it was remotely tied to the original Transformers. and to be honest I never could get past the whole robots turning into animals thing... I even thought the dinobots were a little cheesey

 

So the death of G1 really boils down to they changed too much and dropped the ball.

 

If they would have kept the cartoon going and brought back optimus prime maybe had galvatron go nuts and the megatron side of his personality taken back over, given starscream a new body... They could have made thousands off me by now.

Hasbro had been making so much money$$$$ with the Transformers toy line. Transformers outsold everything, G.I. Joe, Barbie, Cabbage Patch Kids, etc.

 

{snip}

 

Do any of you have any thoughts on this?

I know this wasn't really what you were asking, but I worked in a toy store during G1, the TF weren't anywhere near as popular as any of the lines you mentioned. I remember we actually had to have random draws for Cabbage Patch dolls when we got a case of them.

 

Kids liked the Go-Bots and GI Joe a whole lot more. Probably because the TFs were relatively expensive back then, a standard Autobot cost $8-10 dollars in 1984, which would be the equivalent of ~$20 today. Kids almost never bought these on their own, parents had to buy them. I remember it was pretty easy to sell dads on the Autobot cars, I think most men liked the engineering that went in to them. And the Autobot cars were the only ones that really seemed to sell, the Seekers, OP and Megs were pretty much shelf-warmers.

 

Probably the most popular toy line at the time was still Star Wars. Even years after RotJ came out.

 

However, my answer to your question of what killed G1 is the same as Gaiares': G1's time was simply up. Look at the original Power Rangers ten years ago, or Pokeman five years ago, kids loved them and had to have them, now they could care less about either series.

The radio killed the G1 star......

 

 

ok bad joke.......

 

 

It was the gimmicks the toys were getting, it got way out of control.

I think TFs are here to stay in one form or another now especially with Takaras re-dedication to their core strengths. We will see armada and energon come and go but they should still stick around, boys (and some girls) like vehicles and robots it took a real boardroom of buffoons to screw up and kill G1 but they should ahve learned their lessons by now

 

The alts and collectors stuff is here to stay I pray....on no that rymed....I got Megatron on the G1 Personality test not Wheelie...that was Splendic ;)

 

*edit* Whoo this was my 1000th post

I think TFs are here to stay in one form or another now especially with Takaras re-dedication to their core strengths. We will see armada and energon come and go but they should still stick around, boys (and some girls) like vehicles and robots it took a real boardroom of buffoons to screw up and kill G1 but they should ahve learned their lessons by now

 

The alts and collectors stuff is here to stay I pray....on no that rymed....I got Megatron on the G1 Personality test not Wheelie...that was Splendic ;)

Yeah, I think they'll be around for a while, too. And with the movie coming out I think it will respark kids' (and adults') interest, especially those who may have been lost with CN's crappy programming schedule for Energon.