He already has Starscream in a headlock at that point. What did you think he would do? put him down let him stand up and wait to be punched in the face. As for life and death situations, It's a MOVIE.

First of all, Prime doesn't have Starscream in a headlock - he is holding him approximately horizontally in mid-air. Prime then flips Starscream over, so that he is essentially upside down, and kicks him in the face. This means that Prime's foot has to travel from the ground, to a spot that is virtually at Prime's eye-level, while Prime is balancing the target.

 

The whole thing is, in a word, silly. It's an impractical maneuver. It is not enough to say "Hey, it's a movie" - the scene still has it's own internal logic, and in this particular instance it is violated. When Prime spins Starscream around, he's trying to keep the guy off balance and buy himself enough time to hit Megatron. When Grindor takes a kick to the face, it's almost incidental - Prime is a whirl of limbs lashing out to hit something, anything.

 

When Prime picks up Starscream and kicks him in the face however, he's taking a circuitous route to achieve a minor goal. Seriously, how much damage could Prime have done to Starscream at that point? The latter is basically defenseless - he can't move, he can't bring his weapons to bear on Prime - and the best his opponent could come up with was a gravity-defying boot to the head?

 

Like I said: silly. (And for that matter, endemic of the movie in general.)

He already has Starscream in a headlock at that point. What did you think he would do? put him down let him stand up and wait to be punched in the face. As for life and death situations, It's a MOVIE.

First of all, Prime doesn't have Starscream in a headlock - he is holding him approximately horizontally in mid-air. Prime then flips Starscream over, so that he is essentially upside down, and kicks him in the face. This means that Prime's foot has to travel from the ground, to a spot that is virtually at Prime's eye-level, while Prime is balancing the target.

 

The whole thing is, in a word, silly. It's an impractical maneuver. It is not enough to say "Hey, it's a movie" - the scene still has it's own internal logic, and in this particular instance it is violated. When Prime spins Starscream around, he's trying to keep the guy off balance and buy himself enough time to hit Megatron. When Grindor takes a kick to the face, it's almost incidental - Prime is a whirl of limbs lashing out to hit something, anything.

 

When Prime picks up Starscream and kicks him in the face however, he's taking a circuitous route to achieve a minor goal. Seriously, how much damage could Prime have done to Starscream at that point? The latter is basically defenseless - he can't move, he can't bring his weapons to bear on Prime - and the best his opponent could come up with was a gravity-defying boot to the head?

 

Like I said: silly. (And for that matter, endemic of the movie in general.)

 

For someone who hates the movie you sure do analyze it a lot.

It is giant robots having a fight. If you don't like it, don't watch it.

This was a senseless news post. It's someone making a point about how they didn't like the movie and how bad they expect TF3 to be. I didn't like the film, but I don't have that much time to devote to making that big of a statement. Like some here have said the "I Hate ROTF" fad is far past it's expiration date. I am more concerned with why was this youtube fan made video even considered news in the first place? Don't we have anything on new pictures of new toys to look forward to? How about some reviews? Or is it really that dead in the news room? Oh whatever. The "I Hate ROTF" fad is old it's time to move on.

For someone who hates the movie you sure do analyze it a lot.

It is giant robots having a fight. If you don't like it, don't watch it.

I hate to generalize, but I find it absolutely fascinating that once again a defender of the film is arguing in a logically fallacious fashion (ad hominem, in this particular case). Please, by all means, continue to attempt to paint my motivations as faulty; god only knows you aren't going to dismantle my points with fact and reason.

 

This was a senseless news post. It's someone making a point about how they didn't like the movie and how bad they expect TF3 to be. I didn't like the film, but I don't have that much time to devote to making that big of a statement. Like some here have said the "I Hate ROTF" fad is far past it's expiration date.

I have a theory:

 

There exists a set of people that are highly passionate about the Transformers franchise. (Why not? People are passionate about all sorts of things, irrespective of social expectation.) Inside of this set is a sub-set of people that found Revenge of the Fallen to be an insult to their intelligence; and by extension, an insult to the very franchise the film draws from. Ergo, these people are unhappy.

 

Now, this wouldn't be such an issue if Revenge of the Fallen represented some sort of one-off event; unfortunately, this is not the case. Michael Bay is slated to helm TF3; there has been no public confirmation from Hasbro or Paramount that efforts will be made to reign in his excesses. Throw in the film toys and especially the overabundance of repaints and you've got a situation in which some fans might be left feeling as if their very interest in the Transformers franchise is effectively under assault.

 

So, what do these people do? The only thing they can; unite in criticizing and making light of the perceived source of the problem. It's not as if the fans had any sizable influence to begin with, and that was before Revenge of the Fallen delivered a monster box office take. Why not crack a few more Michael Bay jokes to help speed the next couple of years past?

It's not so much that the movie is hard to follow, it's the action sequences are hard to watch. The robots are far too detailed. Ironically, Skids and Mudflap were pleasant to look at. They actually have faces and have a good arrangement of parts in robot mode that approach my idea of what movie Transformers should look like.

take away the prime fight scene, and it would have been even more obvious for those so easily pleased.

 

I love transforms. I enjoyed TF1. I enjoyed G1. But as i've gotten older, and movies have developed -- I expect more. Heck, I even expect my car to have a/c; get better gas milage; run with less noise; and have more cup holders. So I certainly expect more from a blockbuster with this kind of budget in 2009. Comparing it to the standards of a G1 moving from the 80's is rediculous. To ask for character developement and some descent writing is not too much to ask for. I think it's a little petty to get into analyzing whether an upper cut is a better move than a round house, and getting into such things. Tehse are huge robots and aliens - there is going to be some writers liberties. But how about some writing worthy of a blockbuster??? Anyone that has to resort to potty humor to get a laugh, is just common garbage and lacks any true comic ability. And the rest of the writing, outside of just comedy, wasn't much better.

 

I compare TF2 to the likes of WWF wrestling. Hey, some people get into that kinda stuff. OThers find it fake and cheesey. Different strokes for different folks. AS a movie - i think the 'majority' of film critiques have it right - it just wasn't that great of a movie on it's own merit.

For someone who hates the movie you sure do analyze it a lot.

It is giant robots having a fight. If you don't like it, don't watch it.

I hate to generalize, but I find it absolutely fascinating that once again a defender of the film is arguing in a logically fallacious fashion (ad hominem, in this particular case). Please, by all means, continue to attempt to paint my motivations as faulty; god only knows you aren't going to dismantle my points with fact and reason.

 

This was a senseless news post. It's someone making a point about how they didn't like the movie and how bad they expect TF3 to be. I didn't like the film, but I don't have that much time to devote to making that big of a statement. Like some here have said the "I Hate ROTF" fad is far past it's expiration date.

I have a theory:

 

There exists a set of people that are highly passionate about the Transformers franchise. (Why not? People are passionate about all sorts of things, irrespective of social expectation.) Inside of this set is a sub-set of people that found Revenge of the Fallen to be an insult to their intelligence; and by extension, an insult to the very franchise the film draws from. Ergo, these people are unhappy.

 

Now, this wouldn't be such an issue if Revenge of the Fallen represented some sort of one-off event; unfortunately, this is not the case. Michael Bay is slated to helm TF3; there has been no public confirmation from Hasbro or Paramount that efforts will be made to reign in his excesses. Throw in the film toys and especially the overabundance of repaints and you've got a situation in which some fans might be left feeling as if their very interest in the Transformers franchise is effectively under assault.

 

So, what do these people do? The only thing they can; unite in criticizing and making light of the perceived source of the problem. It's not as if the fans had any sizable influence to begin with, and that was before Revenge of the Fallen delivered a monster box office take. Why not crack a few more Michael Bay jokes to help speed the next couple of years past?

 

I get your point...and I did used to feel the same way. However after seeing what the production companies and the toy companies are willing to accept as the look and feel of their acquired properties, it is clear that the fans care a lot more, than the creators of the franchise, about what happens to its characters, mythos and over all story. While some people here are happy that Orci and Kurtzman are too busy to write TF3 what the fans are missing is that these 2 writers were/are Transformers fans like us. You can see it in TF1 which it was the duo by them selves. It's been stated that all of the elements that ROTF detractors point out are ideas developed by the 3rd writer Ehren Kruger and championed by Bay. When you look at the success of the first movie it was very puzzling as to why a Ehren Kruger was even needed in the first place except if maybe to dilute the creative control that was pretty much held by Orci and Kurtzman. It is a shame because Ehren Kruger, being the writer of the Ring (American version), we should have seen some deep and stellar work from him. So maybe this was one with too many cooks in the kitchen. The Fail really should be awarded to who ever thought the Orci and Kurtzman were not going to be enough. They had Star Trek and their own TV show under their belt with a ton of "comic book" science experience.

 

But after writing all of this out, no studio executive is going to read this or anything else posted by any other fan and say; "wow they got a point!"

 

These exects are only catering to the ignorant who will pay the biggest ticket price and think it was cool. Show them all "bright explosive shit" and "make a lot of f--king noise about it and make it real f--king loud!!!!!". This is the present formula for making money in the theaters. Now the production companies do realize that the theater experience is just the trailer to the DVD/Bluray, right?!?!? At a 2 million only sold on the first day that should be a concern...or maybe not.

I think it's a little petty to get into analyzing whether an upper cut is a better move than a round house, and getting into such things. Tehse are huge robots and aliens - there is going to be some writers liberties.

In the grand scheme of things, it's a small issue; but I think to suggest that what we have is a sort of 'uppercut versus roundhouse' argument is unfair. The issue at it's core is that the fight choreography was interrupted by a maneuver that violated the spirit of the scene and possibly physics. Optimus Prime could have moonwalked away from his adversaries whilst avoiding their blows; however, this would have looked silly. I'm not sure therefore why turning Starscream completely upside down in midair and then kicking him in the face gets a free pass.

 

I get your point...and I did used to feel the same way. However after seeing what the production companies and the toy companies are willing to accept as the look and feel of their acquired properties, it is clear that the fans care a lot more, than the creators of the franchise, about what happens to its characters, mythos and over all story. While some people here are happy that Orci and Kurtzman are too busy to write TF3 what the fans are missing is that these 2 writers were/are Transformers fans like us. You can see it in TF1 which it was the duo by them selves. It's been stated that all of the elements that ROTF detractors point out are ideas developed by the 3rd writer Ehren Kruger and championed by Bay. When you look at the success of the first movie it was very puzzling as to why a Ehren Kruger was even needed in the first place except if maybe to dilute the creative control that was pretty much held by Orci and Kurtzman. It is a shame because Ehren Kruger, being the writer of the Ring (American version), we should have seen some deep and stellar work from him. So maybe this was one with too many cooks in the kitchen. The Fail really should be awarded to who ever thought the Orci and Kurtzman were not going to be enough. They had Star Trek and their own TV show under their belt with a ton of "comic book" science experience.

 

But after writing all of this out, no studio executive is going to read this or anything else posted by any other fan and say; "wow they got a point!"

 

These exects are only catering to the ignorant who will pay the biggest ticket price and think it was cool. Show them all "bright explosive shit" and "make a lot of f--king noise about it and make it real f--king loud!!!!!". This is the present formula for making money in the theaters. Now the production companies do realize that the theater experience is just the trailer to the DVD/Bluray, right?!?!? At a 2 million only sold on the first day that should be a concern...or maybe not.

I do agree that responsibility for the quality of the Transformers films lies wholly with Hasbro and Paramount - as they are ultimately the entities that choose whether to employ someone like Michael Bay, and sign off on the resulting cinematic effort. I think it is extremely telling about these two organizations, and corporate culture in general, that such issues as mass negative critical response and accusations of racism can be brushed aside so easily by the lure of millions of dollars.

 

On a slightly different note; I believe that a substantial amount of blame lies on the shoulders of Orci and Kurtzman when it comes to the general incoherence of the presented narratives. I realized this when I saw Star Trek - I enjoyed the film immensely, but there were several occasions where it was plainly clear that the two writers had set out with a goal in mind and worked their way towards it, logic be damned.

 

Point in question: Kirk is stranded on an ice planet. A local creature then jumps out and chases him, only for another planetary denizen to jump out and kill Kirk's pursuer. The larger creature then starts chasing Kirk. Why? Sure, it makes for a comedic moment - but why would the creature leave it's larger prize behind and chase after a tiny little human? (And let's not cover the fact that this creature is bright red on an ice-covered world.)

 

Kirk is saved by Spock, who is wielding an impromptu torch. How, though? Spock was also stranded on this world; in that short space of time he found himself a dry piece of wood (from where exactly?) and then set it alight, somehow.

 

And let's not even cover the fact that at the film's finale, Kirk intentionally orders the Enterprise to remain in close proximity to a growing black hole, just so he could fire on the bad guy's ship (which, coincidentally, was already breaking up in the center of the black hole.) Kirk then expresses puzzlement bordering on alarm when said newly-formed black hole starts to suck in the Enterprise! Of course, it turns out that escape is possible when one ejects the Enterprise's main engine and detonates it, using the shockwave to push the vessel out of harm's way... although the physics involved in that one, well...

 

The two writers have stated previously that they used to spend their time reverse-engineering movies they enjoyed, and it shows - Orci and Kurtzman appear to have developed a highly successful formula for producing premier, high-octane summer blockbuster material. The only problem is that when it comes to linking these memorable scenes together in a logically consistent way, they fall down - thoughtfully crafted narratives are not their strong point.

 

Now, does this absolve Kruger? Not at all... and whilst I admit that I enjoyed his previous work on The Ring and The Skeleton Key, it doesn't change the fact that the guy's not had a lot in the way of critical praise. Still... plenty of blame to go around.

Ok fuck this "defender" and "i am a hater" bull shit. Who the hell needs to defend why they like the movie? I dunno why people get off on this crap. Get over it already, people enjoyed the movie. And thats that, you don't liek it then fine.... but stop with the dogma.

 

 

Funny thing is, the movies had the same level of story telling as any of the cartoons. What more did you want? its a movie based on a toy line ffs, about robots that fight eachother. Just an army movie wth giant robots...

I'm still annoyed with what they did to Devastator.....