When you said Sisko I was thinking Trekker. Good choice, I do consider him the bad ass of Star Fleet captains

 

However I'm tired of this, and with the original argument won Animorphs is not a TF Toy line

 

so I want to take this in a different direction like I tried to before.

 

I just want to know why you chose to ignore the Animorphs logo

When you said Sisko I was thinking Trekker. Good choice, I do consider him the bad ass of Star Fleet captains

 

Sisko is the man.

 

However I'm tired of this, and with the original argument won Animorphs is not a TF Toy line

 

Dude, I dont want to sound rude, but you havent wont scwat.

 

Nothing you have said refutes the fact that the TF logo was on those box'es and that Hasbro placed them there by intent.

so I want to take this in a different direction like I tried to before.

 

I just want to know why you chose to ignore the Animorphs logo

 

I'm not ignoring it at all.

 

But the owner of the Animorphs book does not manufacture toys.

 

So you can call it an other joint venture if you like.

 

But having the TF brand on the box'es makes them a TF toyline.

 

Hasbro makes millions of different toys, but only a select amount get labeled a TF toyline.

 

A toy doesnt even have to transform to be labeled a tf toy.

 

And I'm not going twards action masters.

 

Look at the radio control movie Bumblebee or even those Match box looking little cars.

 

None of the fit what I think should be a TF, but Hasbro saw fit to label them TF's.

 

So they are TF toys.

 

Just like Animorphs.

How about those Revoltech toys of Convoy, Hotrodimus, Starscream, Megatron and Ultra Magnus?

 

Should they be considered a "fake" TF toyline?

How about those Revoltech toys of Convoy, Hotrodimus, Starscream, Megatron and Ultra Magnus?

 

Should they be considered a "fake" TF toyline?

 

I dont have an, wish I did.

 

But I believe they have been officially released with Takara blessing or they are Takara products.

 

so, I would say they are defiantly TF's.

BTW guys, if I dont check in by tomorrow, Happy Turkey day.

I think the Star Wars crossovers are the nearest example to illustrate the point.

That particular fictional universe was originally created entirely outside of Transformers (like the Animorph books) and in a different media (the movie predating even G1). None of the bots in the crossover line are in any way connected to Transformers at all (they all follow Star Wars themes and characters). So the line is a 'Star Wars' line that happens to have the TF logo on it, rather than being a TF line that happens to use Star Wars characters.

 

Ditto with Animorphs... They are a toyline from a different fictional franchise that Hasbro has put under the Transformers banner, for better or worse. I would argue that was a huge mistake by Hasbro, but remember that at that time Beast-style TFs were all the rage, so you can't really blame 'em for trying, huh? :P

 

While I agree, the SW cross overs and the Marvel crossovers are the nearest examples in recent history, I still see a bit of a difference.

 

Both Star Wars and MaRVEL HAVE HAD TYHEIR OWN TOYLINES FOR YEARS.

 

There's nothing stopping them from creating a "transforming" toyline for their characters with out involving Hasbro in any way.

 

As a matter of fact, Marvel had a line of Transforming Marvel superheroes a few years back which hyad no connection to the TF brand what so ever.No log no nothing.

 

So, getting Hasbro involved, by intenmt, makes them a sub-line of the tf lines.

I think the Star Wars crossovers are the nearest example to illustrate the point.

That particular fictional universe was originally created entirely outside of Transformers (like the Animorph books) and in a different media (the movie predating even G1). None of the bots in the crossover line are in any way connected to Transformers at all (they all follow Star Wars themes and characters). So the line is a 'Star Wars' line that happens to have the TF logo on it, rather than being a TF line that happens to use Star Wars characters.

 

Ditto with Animorphs... They are a toyline from a different fictional franchise that Hasbro has put under the Transformers banner, for better or worse. I would argue that was a huge mistake by Hasbro, but remember that at that time Beast-style TFs were all the rage, so you can't really blame 'em for trying, huh? :P

 

While I agree, the SW cross overs and the Marvel crossovers are the nearest examples in recent history, I still see a bit of a difference.

 

Both Star Wars and MaRVEL HAVE HAD TYHEIR OWN TOYLINES FOR YEARS.

 

There's nothing stopping them from creating a "transforming" toyline for their characters with out involving Hasbro in any way.

 

As a matter of fact, Marvel had a line of Transforming Marvel superheroes a few years back which hyad no connection to the TF brand what so ever.No log no nothing.

 

So, getting Hasbro involved, by intenmt, makes them a sub-line of the tf lines.

True, and I'd guess there was no other reason for Lucas or Marvel to go to Hasbro with the crossovers other than the 'cash-in factor' of the Transformers name on the box. Takara's Disney Label TFs stand on the same shakey ground - to me it's obvious they are not true Transformers, but the brand name is being used because it's the obvious thing to do. Still, other companies have done similar on their own; we've already had mention of the Turtles that turned into vehicles, and I came across this the other day...

:rofl

Not by Hasbro but the same exact idea. Anyway, as you said, with Animorphs it was apparently Hasbro that originated the toyline; they saw a tie-in opportunity and took it. Which is why I think you are correct, they are a Transformers toyline. Not in 'spirit', but in every other way.

Was I wrong about this guy being a trouble maker, or what? ;)

 

Just seems like built up angst from someone who's bitter that there are Star Wars TF's crossovers and not Star Trek one's :tfevil

 

Funny, but you would be wrong.

 

I really dont like the cross overs at all, but at least the SW ones are pretty cool looking.

 

I dread the idea of as Kirk that becomes the Enterprise.

 

BTW, I'm as much a SW fan as I am a Trekie.

When you already have a thread buried in this debate then need another to invite opinions, but hack up said opinions as invalid and wrong, you will not get many others willing to join in as would otherwise. To debate you need to be open to others opinions not just say that they are wrong because theirs don't match yours.

 

I believe I asked for logical arguments for or against that didnt rely on personal views and or definitions.

 

But if I wasnt very clear I am sorry.

 

No need to be sorry, I probably forgot what the thread was about. It kinda felt different to me for some reason.

 

And about Kirk becoming the Enterprise :puke I agree. I would rather have the Enterprise transform into any kind of robot :bounce

I'm not ignoring it at all.

 

But the owner of the Animorphs book does not manufacture toys.

 

So you can call it an other joint venture if you like.

 

But having the TF brand on the box'es makes them a TF toyline.

 

Hasbro makes millions of different toys, but only a select amount get labeled a TF toyline.

 

A toy doesnt even have to transform to be labeled a tf toy.

 

And I'm not going twards action masters.

 

Look at the radio control movie Bumblebee or even those Match box looking little cars.

 

None of the fit what I think should be a TF, but Hasbro saw fit to label them TF's.

 

So they are TF toys.

 

Just like Animorphs.

 

You are ignoring it. For something like Animorphs which has a previous history, and where Hasbro's only intent was mass marketing to a wider audience. You can not just take the fact that the packaging has the Transformers logo on it. The toys are only a part of the Franchise. When Animorphs was big it had books, a tv show, a video game, and toys. And it was only the toys that had the logo the rest did not

 

Here is another part of the press release I've shown before

 

Licensing Do's:

 

* Toys should be age-appropriate for the target audience of the books and TV show.

 

* Animorphs, not Transformers, should be the most important logo.

 

* Pay particular attention to the use of the word "morph" and the way the property is described in order to emphasize that the property and the toys are not just about morphing.

 

* Focus on the property as a whole, as opposed to the stars of the TV show.

 

Right there in black and white. Animorphs should be the most important logo. That is from Hasbro and Scholastic. And you are saying the opposite of what their intent was

 

And focus on the property as a whole

 

Now using your logic about logo and intent and relating to Hasbro's intent. Animorphs is not a TF toy line

 

Just by Branding something doesn't make it so. Now for the RPMs? Those are a TF Toy line because it was Hasbro's intent to create, make, and sell Hot wheels style cars based off of characters from their TF lines

 

 

Hasbro never meant for Animorphs to be a TF Toy line.

 

Black and White, plain as day

 

 

You lost this one.

 

Happy Thanksgiving, I'm stuck cooking the turkey this year

True, and I'd guess there was no other reason for Lucas or Marvel to go to Hasbro with the crossovers other than the 'cash-in factor' of the Transformers name on the box. Takara's Disney Label TFs stand on the same shakey ground - to me it's obvious they are not true Transformers, but the brand name is being used because it's the obvious thing to do.Still, other companies have done similar on their own; we've already had mention of the Turtles that turned into vehicles, and I came across this the other day...

:rofl

Not by Hasbro but the same exact idea. Anyway, as you said, with Animorphs it was apparently Hasbro that originated the toyline; they saw a tie-in opportunity and took it. Which is why I think you are correct, they are a Transformers toyline. Not in 'spirit', but in every other way.

Well, determining "true" falls in the category of personal definitions....and at heart, I'm a business man.Been in retail my entire life.I'm overly analytical.So I always see things from the point of view of "what was the bottom line goal when taking these actions"???

 

"What was the result they intended"??

 

And when you look at it that way theres only one answer.

 

I mean, I really dont like to think of them as TF's, but Hasbro has forced that on us.

 

Blue and red post man ....funny.

 

And thanks.

 

No need to be sorry, I probably forgot what the thread was about. It kinda felt different to me for some reason.

 

And about Kirk becoming the Enterprise :puke I agree. I would rather have the Enterprise transform into any kind of robot :bounce

 

Thats the nature of these threads.

 

They start off one way and then grow.

 

You are ignoring it. For something like Animorphs which has a previous history, and where Hasbro's only intent was mass marketing to a wider audience. You can not just take the fact that the packaging has the Transformers logo on it. The toys are only a part of the Franchise. When Animorphs was big it had books, a tv show, a video game, and toys. And it was only the toys that had the logo the rest did not

 

I'm not ignoring it at all.

 

Its not relevant to the topic at hand.I never said the toyline didnt also belong to Animorphs.

 

Just like trhe cross overs its a joint venture.

 

Look at 1 of your examples.

 

Animorphs had a video game.

 

I dont know who produced the game but for arguments sake lets say it was made by Atari.

 

It would be considered a product of Atari and Animnorphs, not just Animorphs.

 

 

I read your line, doesnt change anything.

Right there in black and white. Animorphs should be the most important logo. That is from Hasbro and Scholastic.

 

Doesnt change anything.

 

It was still a joint venture.And I dont see how having a bigger logo means anything.

 

Maybe if the TF logo was only in "FINE PRINT" because thats never really intended to be read.

 

But bigger or smaller, the TF logo is clear to see, its intended to inspire a connection between the lines for the purpos of incressing sales.

 

Which is the ultimate goal of creating the brand in the first place.

 

Let me ask you something.

 

Why do you think bigger means more importasnt??

 

And I know howe that question sounds but I'm not joking.

 

Now using your logic about logo and intent and relating to Hasbro's intent. Animorphs is not a TF toy line

 

My logic has nothing to do with how predominate the logo is.

 

Simply that if the logo is clear, then their intent is clear.

 

"Your own source states that the intent was to increese sales.So they added them to the tf brand."

 

Well, since the intent in manufacturing the toys in the first place is to make sales, placeing the TF logo on them makes them a TF toyline.

Now for the RPMs? Those are a TF Toy line because it was Hasbro's intent to create, make, and sell Hot wheels style cars based off of characters from their TF lines

 

You got a double standard going here.

 

Hasbro never meant for Animorphs to be a TF Toy line.

 

Their intent is revealed by the action of useing the logo.

 

Whats the goal of making toys??

 

Sales

 

Any actions taken to increase sales is offical.

 

Placing the line under the TF banner was one of those actions.

 

Its a tf toyline.

 

Black and White, plain as day

 

You lost this one.

 

Again, your dreaming.

 

I've said it before I'll say it again.

 

Nothing, and I mean NOTHING you have said changes the fact that Hasbro place3d the TF logo on the boxes by intent.

 

Which made them a TF toyline.

 

Your argument has failed.

 

Happy Thanksgiving, I'm stuck cooking the turkey this year

 

I've been doing the same since yesterday.

 

Enjoy.