...

I personally think they were not completely dead, ,but had run out of energon or were so low on enregon they couldn't move. Because when Unicron frist talks his energy pushes the rest of the 'Cons back and unlike Megatron they don't move a bit, they jsut get pushed back in a stiff pose.

 

So I think it was that they just physically couldn't move. They had not turned grey/black as Prime or Prowl had done...Yes I know Brawn never turned grey either...well to me he hadn't actually died just yet, he was in the process of dying when they cut to him falling over and then in the backgroudn shot of the 'Cons taking over the shuttle.

If Unicron could in fact create new life, why would he have needed to repair/reformat anyone. He could have just made the newly built starship into a mega transformer, given him life and sent him to kill Magnus and get the Matrix. It would have stopped there from being any rebelious bahavior, as was the case with Galvatron.

 

For that reason I have to say that they were in some way still alive when they got to Unicron.

...

I think that the rest had gone into stasis lock and when Unicron revived them he had "adjusted" their sparks accordingly, because they were actually offline.

I actually think this a significant question in regards to the overall TF mythos. Because the real issue is, does someone/something other than Vector Sigma have the power to create Transformers' sparks? In other words, who has the power to give TFs life?

 

Back in G1 days, this wasn't such a big deal at all. TF:TM was written before "The Key to Vector Sigma" aired, and the conventional wisdom up to that point was that TFs were essentially machines that could be built (i.e. the Dinobots, Constructicons, etc.). But post-Beast era, this becomes a bit of a thorny issue. To put it into human terms, would we like the idea that the Devil could create life in the same way that God can?

 

Clearly Cyclonus and Scourge weren't Skywarp and Thundercracker (or whoever -- I'm not interested in that argument again) in some sense. Their personalities were totally different, for one thing. But does that mean that they were different beings altogether, i.e. had different sparks? Or were their sparks simply modified in some way? And if so, how?

 

However, this is all retcon-land, to be sure. In context, the clear assumption seems to have been that Scourge and Cyclonus were supposed to be new TFs with no relation to their former selves. But as I mentioned above, that does cause problems when you consider the implications for Unicron's power.

There's another possibility as well.

 

What if some where alive and some weren't? Perhaps the reason that Skywarp and Thundercracker (or whoever) became Cyclonus and Scourge was because they were still alive. The others were dead, so they became kinda like zombie footsoldiers.

 

Well, even if it isn't a possibility, it sounds cool to me ... :thumb

Unicron cannot create new sparks... but he can send his energies to take hold of others that are in a weakened state. Sorta the opposite of the Matrix there... he needs a weak body to infest, rather then a strong.

That reminds me of Nemesis Prime's "Dead Matrix" description. That and the fact that he had that matrix given to him from Unicron.

Clearly Cyclonus and Scourge weren't Skywarp and Thundercracker (or whoever -- I'm not interested in that argument again) in some sense. Their personalities were totally different, for one thing. But does that mean that they were different beings altogether, i.e. had different sparks? Or were their sparks simply modified in some way? And if so, how?

Well, just look at Beast Machines. Tankorr, & Jetstorm had no idea who they were after being placed in the vehicon bodies, not until Rattrap woke up Rhinox in Tankorr by interfacing with him and then BlackArachnia woke up Silverbolt. Same spark, different body & mind, but the 'soul' of the spark could still be brought out.

 

Another way to think is the theory of reincarnation.... a person dies in this life, and comes back as a fly. Does it retain any memories of it's previous life? Possibly, but the current body would not have the capacity to recognize it. Flies do what flies do, even if they were your great-uncle herman or whatever. The spark's will do what the body has the capacity to do, and if they were under stasis lock, then they wouldn't have had the conciousness to be aware of being reformatted and changed. Megatron however was concious, and Unicron needed him to be aware, and modified him accordingly so, but not without a built in failsafe to keep Galvatron in line.

eh, the writers were probably just trying to save money on voice actor costs.

I like the idea that they were weakened and Unicron corrupted their sparks, similar to the Beast Machines Vehicon leaders. (Thad's idea.)