Why do people layers of depth to the autobots and decpticons in G1? I mean, they're all stereotypes in the first place. there's no issue of the decepticons being rebels because they don't liek the system. they're meant ot be evil, if they don't come off that way, it's due to poor writing. true, in many of the G1 alternate universes, the decepticons start off as a rebel factions, but they always go insane and evil in the end.

 

one common sentiment I see is that the autobots are nothign more than people who manipulate morals to sound rightous and good. people, PLEASE remember that thety weren't written like that! the autobots are simplistic because they were originally written for children. Autobot=good, Decepticon=bad. it's that simple. Optimus really DOES stand for freedom of all sentient beings. all he wants is to liberate those who are being ruled by a tyrant, by a ruthless leader, etc.  Megatron really does stand for peace through tyranny. all he wants to rule the universe, and either enslavement or destruction of the Autobots.

 

Keep in mind this is solely about G1. another thing to keep in mind. Up until dreamwave came about, G1 was meant mostly for kids. it's not going ot have the depth some of you are attributing to it, especially the cartoon. it's THE worst offender, as it had not only the worst writing, but the most inconsistant.

 

I still love G1(Hell, I bought a hardcover version of the Primal Scream trade just yesterday, and I wish to own the G1 cartoon.), but like Armada and Energon, it's not written that well overall. i admit i haven't read any of the Dreamwave G1 other than a few pages, so that could be different, and from what I've heard, I fully expect it to be.

Optimus really DOES stand for freedom of all sentient beings.

 

I don't know about this one. He treated the Dinbots pretty badly and demonizes anybody that doesn't agree with his definition of freedom.

 

I think this is where it all started. People started to go into depth about Optimus Prime and how good and holy he is, like he was the second coming or something. To me, Optimus Prime is and always has been a mediocre toy, nothing more, nothing less.

 

It comes down to having a cult built around a character. People start to give that character more meaning, more value, and more symbols than it really has, whether it be Optimus Prime, Ultra Magnus, Megatron, Starscream, et cetera.

Optimus really DOES stand for freedom of all sentient beings.

 

I don't know about this one. He treated the Dinbots pretty badly and demonizes anybody that doesn't agree with his definition of freedom.

 

chalk t hat up to poor writing. again, G1 cartoon is notorious for this. i dunno if that happened in the G1 comic though. I read all of the G2 comic, and optimus highly respected Grimlock. seeing as how it's both a continuation of the Marvel G1 comic and was written by the guy who wrote much of the Marvel G1 comics(Furman started working on the UK comic at issue 17, and started on the US comic at issue 56.), i don't think there was a difference between how Optimus treated the Dinobots in the G1 comics and G2.

I always saw it as a last huzzah to the cold war Regan vs Gorbi(i have no clue how to spell the guys name).

Chalk it up to changes in political climate -

we as a society are much more ambivilant towards leaders claiming ABSOLUTE definitions of GOOD and EVIL (Axis my ass...)

 

You even said it yourself - G1 has changed its meaning, tone and resonance..

you say "until dreamwave..." But if you accept DW as being Cannon - then  you have to accept that CURRENT cannon is aimed at 30 year olds....

 

Whats more - your comments sound very heavily CARTOON biased.  The Marvel Comics were not so Black & White.... and many of the board memebers grew up with the comics, considering them just as relevant IF NOT MORE SO than the cartoon

 

Hunter

Chalk it up to changes in political climate -

we as a society are much more ambivilant towards leaders claiming ABSOLUTE definitions of GOOD and EVIL (Axis my ass...)

 

You even said it yourself - G1 has changed its meaning, tone and resonance..

you say "until dreamwave..." But if you accept DW as being Cannon - then  you have to accept that CURRENT cannon is aimed at 30 year olds....

 

Whats more - your comments sound very heavily CARTOON biased.  The Marvel Comics were not so Black & White.... and many of the board memebers grew up with the comics, considering them just as relevant IF NOT MORE SO than the cartoon

 

Hunter

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

my comments were cartoon BASED because most of thje people I see makign these arguements base theirs off of the cartoons. this rant was mainly targeted to those people. i don't remember any names(:redface), but i wouldn't name them anyway.

I have a Joe collecter friend (Alyosha for those who know him from the Joe boards) who I think has the right idea. He hates the Joe show but loves the old comic. Even that however he takes with a grain of salt. It all boils down to the toys and techspec/filecards. By the very nature of only having a paragraph or couple of lines from the show to flush out a bio, you have to make the rest of the story yourself. Everyone will do this a little differently and then forget that their story is not the same that your neighbour had for his toys.

DECEPTICONS=MILITARY HARDWARE.

AUTOBOTS  =CONSUMER GOODS.

 

G1 origins official animated version.

 

PRIMUS vs UNICRON,

Line between the Autobots/Decepticons blurred (more different point of view via degrees  of seperation)

Late G1 comic version ( marvel )

Also the basis of  ARMADA onwords,...NUFF SAID ?!!?  :roll

I look at it this way....

 

 

Does it really matter what one person thinks? I mean is it really important what their opinion is and whether or not it affects your's? Well if they're two separate opinions and you're both going to stick to your guns...who gives a crap? They don't NEED to interact, or intertwine with one another. Think and feel how you want, and I'll think and feel how *I* want. Simple as that. If we have differing views, I'll have to deal with it and so will you. If you can't then you're just being a whiney brat and an attention whore, that which I will not give you the pleasure of. Deal with your lack of 15 seconds of fame, deal with other people having an opinion, keep your own and shut up!

 

Telling someone or forcing them to see your view, your world does nothing. If anything, it makes them fight harder against you.

 

These are toys, cartoons, and characters that do not exist as real people. It's nice escapism, and it's fun. Hell I collect 'em and watch the show. I even have my view of it...doesn't mean your's is any worse than mine or any better, it's just the same because....it's important to someone, and that's all that matters.

 

 

My view is:

 

Primus IS their God. Unicron is the fallen Angel that becomes Satan, and there are both sides of the battle, Good (Autobots) and Evil (Decepticons).

Prime's not so much a Christ figure (although people mistook his return in G1 as that and I'm sure it was probably written as that in some instances, it was nothing more than a ploy to bring back a famous character to save the show from slumping ratings and save the line. That's all it is. Some people who are zealots (I.E. like Raksha for instance) took it to heart and just carried it like a football for the Hail Mary play. It's nothing more than a marketing plot.) Prime's more of a chosen messenger, handpicked by Primus himself to deliver the message and bring hope to those who have none. He's "human" which means he's imperfect, prone to failure, and does the wrong thing some of the time. He's by no means perfect and most certainly tries to seek forgiveness in the good deeds he does. Megatron is the foolish Faust. He believes if he has the ultimate power he'll be a God and therefore unstoppable. There's only one God and he ain't him, thus he's already sold his Spark to the Devil (Unicron) and he's pretty much shot himself in the foot. Still makes a mess of it though along the way. The rest of the cast is just a little more than plain old filler. Some of them have backstories, others are just there for decoration.

 

Simple as that. (Just FYI)

I look at it this way....

 

 

Does it really matter what one person thinks? I mean is it really important what their opinion is and whether or not it affects your's? Well if they're two separate opinions and you're both going to stick to your guns...who gives a crap? They don't NEED to interact, or intertwine with one another. Think and feel how you want, and I'll think and feel how *I* want. Simple as that. If we have differing views, I'll have to deal with it and so will you. If you can't then you're just being a whiney brat and an attention whore, that which I will not give you the pleasure of. Deal with your lack of 15 seconds of fame, deal with other people having an opinion, keep your own and shut up!

 

Telling someone or forcing them to see your view, your world does nothing. If anything, it makes them fight harder against you.

 

These are toys, cartoons, and characters that do not exist as real people. It's nice escapism, and it's fun. Hell I collect 'em and watch the show. I even have my view of it...doesn't mean your's is any worse than mine or any better, it's just the same because....it's important to someone, and that's all that matters.

 

 

My view is:

 

Primus IS their God. Unicron is the fallen Angel that becomes Satan, and there are both sides of the battle, Good (Autobots) and Evil (Decepticons).

Prime's not so much a Christ figure (although people mistook his return in G1 as that and I'm sure it was probably written as that in some instances, it was nothing more than a ploy to bring back a famous character to save the show from slumping ratings and save the line. That's all it is. Some people who are zealots (I.E. like Raksha for instance) took it to heart and just carried it like a football for the Hail Mary play. It's nothing more than a marketing plot.) Prime's more of a chosen messenger, handpicked by Primus himself to deliver the message and bring hope to those who have none. He's "human" which means he's imperfect, prone to failure, and does the wrong thing some of the time. He's by no means perfect and most certainly tries to seek forgiveness in the good deeds he does. Megatron is the foolish Faust. He believes if he has the ultimate power he'll be a God and therefore unstoppable. There's only one God and he ain't him, thus he's already sold his Spark to the Devil (Unicron) and he's pretty much shot himself in the foot. Still makes a mess of it though along the way. The rest of the cast is just a little more than plain old filler. Some of them have backstories, others are just there for decoration.

 

Simple as that. (Just FYI)