The last few Transformers shows have been made in Japan and I never hid my dissapointment when it comes to those shows.

 

There are just differences between US and Japan made shows and for a US influenced mind the Japanese shows take getting used to.

 

I got in RM-23 Lio Convoy with DVD. The metallic paint aps are cool (though I already have a pain chip behind the mane) but the figure itself is not spectacular. The DVD it came with was nice though.

 

I really liked the Robot Master episode. The computer animation was good and even though I had no idea what was said they were the best fight scenes since Beast Wars/Beast Machines.

 

Convoy being flowin in my Victory Leo and racing to and ramming Beast Megatron only to transform halfway and smack him was awesome. Beast Convoy's imitation of King Kong and then using is agility to put the whammy on Starscream was pretty cool as well.

 

Sadly the episode ended with all Convoys combing their energy. The Megatrons did the same and were beaten.

 

Which seems to be the case for most Japanese TF cartoons. Instead of beating their enemy with their individual skills, a Transformer will just pull out a special attack to smash him.

 

R.I.D. was full of attacks that seems to have been lifted out of Streetfighter/Mortal Kombat/Tekken. The Transformers even "announced their attacks in a similar way to SF2.'

 

Have not seen much of Energon but it relies mostly on 2 Transformers combining. When Wing Saber was introduced, Optimus did nothing but combine with him. One would think that he would have more skills to beat an opponent but sadly not.

 

Robot Masters started off really good but it ended rather dissapointingly. At times the Transformers cartoons remind me of Power Rangers. When one's "super-attack mode" is not working they bust out a "mega-attack" mode.

 

Personally I think it is a bit lame and it makes me wish for the Beast Wars days where a Transformer did not have such attack modes but just had to use their intelligence and skill to take down opponents.

 

My favorite moment must be Rattrap destroying Ravage's ship. Rattrap is not exceptionally strong nor all that well armed. (Except for his exposives that is.) But he did have street smarts and guts.

 

So he grabbed a plasma torch and transformed into roadie mode and using a made shift ramp he actually made it on top of Ravage's cruiser. He then made a hole using the torch and enlarged it using his teeth in rat mode. When he was inside he simply used his explosives to blow up Ravage's cruiser.

 

"Super attack my skid plate." Rattrap would have said.  :tftongue

 

I really miss those days.  :tfsad

 

And of course the other major difference is the Japanese habit* to put (annoying) kids in a cartoon. That alone would not be that much of an issue. Daniel was rather annoying but he never "took over" the show.

 

The Armada Kids and Kicker were annoying. Expecially Kicker whom I really hate. Even the toy sucked.  :tdown

 

* The exception being Robot Masters but sadly even that had its fault with the ending.

 

What do all of you think about this? Of course the people who grew up with the Japanese cartoons will like that approach better. I am a Geewunner who grew up with the G1 cartoon (and later learned to love Beast Wars) so the "US approach" is "the way" for Transformers for me.

I agree completely..... I believe the guy who wrote the Binaltech story (a Japanese guy) said that in Japanese cartoons, whoever has the most power is the best, whereas in Western cartoons, whoever controls their power most is the best. I think that's a very insightful statement. Every Japanese cartoon/TV show I've seen is all about one-upping your opponent through brute strength or some kind of special attack. There is no emphasis on mental agility, planning, stealth, resourcefulness, ingenuity, or any of that. It all boils down to your "hit points". Which is lame IMO.

this topic is becoming the next RIB/FIR. it's been argued into the ground but it always boils down to cultural differences. IMHO, the japanese cultural attitudes show some similarities to the philosophe of Nieztche: the strong dominate, the weak aren't given any mercy, man is superior to nature etc etc.

this topic is becoming the next RIB/FIR. it's been argued into the ground but it always boils down to cultural differences. IMHO, the japanese cultural attitudes show some similarities to the philosophe of Nieztche: the strong dominate, the weak aren't given any mercy, man is superior to nature etc etc.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

...or, it could be that the writers of 99% of the anime storylines use the same "plot line" ad nausum.

 

I agree with bigds9fan and LM. While I agree with the fact that culture plays a huge role in the writing, it's not an excuse to write a lame and rehashed story. More lame idiosyncrasies I've observed in Japanese cartoons:

 

- Everything is "energy this" and "energy that." After watching each episode of TF: Energon, I felt like I walked out of a yoga class.

 

- The old Japanese adage that "if you're a big guy, you're stupid." This is not just for cartoons (i.e. Tidal Wave), but in video games as well (i.e. Darkstalker's Victor and Street Fighter's Zangief.)

 

- Characters laughing out of place or over stupid/ridiculous situations.

 

- Long and pointless pauses to add "dramatic suspense."

 

- Characters putting their arms behind their heads for no reason.

 

- The aformentioned "I can't do squat to my enemies unless I unleash my super attack energy/__________ attack/whateverIcanmergewith combination/monkeyfecesthrowing special combo/whatever special attack.

 

- Kids used as a characters who overtakes the annoyance factor in the show.

 

 

To my chagrin, this was the same since R.I.D. - I was hoping that TF: Armada would be different, but nope, it's still the same garbage. I know this maybe an insult to the aniime fans out there, but it's true. A lot of the anime uses the same ad lib plotlines and if you strip out the pretty pictures, TF: Energon is the same as Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within.

interesting. i wonder if anime having reusable plot-lines has anything to do with the japanese "conformist" additude. maybe that's why anime writers are reluctant to break the mold.

That seems to be the case as Energon and Armada had very few memorable characters whereas Beast Wars/Beast Machines had plenty.

 

No need to guess my favorite: Rattrap. In the "last Energon episode" Xbob comments that he is a typical veteran. Can you believe that guy.  :tflaugh  Neither of the Maximals are veterans as they have always been at peace.

 

Most veterans complain about the youger ones (Ironhide) or tell endless stories (Kup). Rattrap did neither, he just complained a lot. And in the first Beast Wars episode he actually disobeys Optimus when his orders were perfectly sound. Not something a veteran would do at all.

 

Beast Wars also featured Rhinox who was the "strong man" of the group but also the scientist. So he is basically Ben Grimm and Reed Richards rolled into one.  :tflaugh

 

Americans are also willing to try different storylines. Star Trek Enterprise was as huge a change as Beast Machines. Both had their flaws, I will admit that. But I am also more than willing to defend them because both were excellent and refreshing shows.

 

The Transformers ability to change (literally) is their greatest asset. By this I mean their ability to adapt to new ideas. When toy company Galoob made Micromachines which became popular Hasbro came up with Micromasters.

 

Since Hasbro now owns Galoob, it is easy to see that this approach works. And Micromasters were excellent toys as well. I love them and their bases.  :thumb

 

The gimmics for the Armada/Energon toys were neat. I really liked the Mini-Cons as the Transformer would have a partner to help him in combat. But in the Armada cartoon the whole concept was misused.

 

The DW comics helped a little to improve things by making them able to talk and such. Really gave the little guys depth and personalities which they also did for the Autobots and Decepticons.

 

That is what sells a toy, the show character. In G1 there were plenty of "bad" toys. But we did not care because the character rocked. Everyone wanted Starscream despite the fact that he was a brick. I have always wanted G1 Ruckuss for his tough guy bio. I finally got him. The toy is bad but he is such a bad-ass bot that it makes the toy cool again.  :thumb

 

The Energon characters did little. Were I to use the show and only the show to decide wheter to get Energon Prime I would have passed up on him. I mean Kicker yelled at him like the idiot he was and he just took it.  :tdown

 

I would have liked to see G1 Seawatch in that position. I bet Kicker would have gotten a mouthful. Even G1 Prime (despite him being a noble character) would not have stood for that.  :tflaugh  E-Prime is just a wuss. Of course the toy could have been better too though that was moderately cool.

 

But cool characters sell toys. Who would not want to own Beast Wars Megatron, Dinobot or Rattrap. Not to mention R.I.D. Scourge and a lot of the G1 characters. Armada and Energon so do not get that.  :tdown

 

And The cartoons have not been innovative at all. And what does not change becomes extinct. It is one of the most basic laws of nature.

 

The Transformers have an ability to adapt that is unprecedented in toy history. (The only toyline that can match, or even outdo Transformers, is Lego.) But as long as the cartoon is made by the Japanese I do not get my hopes up for such nessecary change.

the Charector is RID anounsed there attacks Becuse it was a Parady of the later Japenese TF shows

God Magnus=Victory Lio

GelShark=Goryu

Gigatron=Dezarus

etc. etc.

I agree completely..... I believe the guy who wrote the Binaltech story (a Japanese guy) said that in Japanese cartoons, whoever has the most power is the best, whereas in Western cartoons, whoever controls their power most is the best. I think that's a very insightful statement. Every Japanese cartoon/TV show I've seen is all about one-upping your opponent through brute strength or some kind of special attack. There is no emphasis on mental agility, planning, stealth, resourcefulness, ingenuity, or any of that. It all boils down to your "hit points". Which is lame IMO.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

i agree with ya

 

ps. that BT guy is Hirofumi Ichikawa

 

its a shame new shows cant have a ballence combiners could give the japanese all the 1+1=3 uber power stuff they want and for the US/rest of the world they could give us guys like in G1 and BW who fight with wit and fire power etc

The problem is that we never got those shows in the US so why bother translating that bit? It does not matter to translate a joke someone else would never get.

 

And the heart of the matter is that characters still relied more on their special attacks to defeat an opponent instead of ther overall skill. Try using that tactic in Steetfighter (e.g. only using Ryu's fireball attack and nothing else) and you will have your ass kicked in no time.

 

I actually though that would work (hey I was still very young then) but using that attack leaves one wide open for a counterattack. I later learned that one beats most opponents with intelligence and regular skills.

 

Japanese cartoons treat special moves like they can take on anything and if one move fails then they invent a more powerful one.

Great read.  I'd like to say even the Japanese continuation of G1 (Headmasters, Masterforce, Victory) used combining as a "super power" of sorts.  Fort Max with that circle of power crap at the end of Headmasters, God Jinrai, Victory Saber, so on, so forth.

 

Whereas in G1 the Gestalts, and the cityformers were huge, they never really decided the final battle.