Question about Bludgeon

[Goktimus Prime]

robots knowing kung fu is lame.

Why?

 

These robots are at war. The most basic weapon in a fight is your body. Every civilisation we know of has had a history of conflict, and as a result, every civilisation has developed some form of martial art (re: pugilism).

 

Modern boxing, fencing and wrestling all come from old European martial arts - albeit their forms have greatly changed since their original forms. Western European boxing, in its earlier forms, would have been far more advanced than the modern form and not too dissimilar to what is commonly perceived as martial arts today. In fact, Kung Fu is also known as Chinese Boxing, and the Boxer Rebellion (aka Boxer Uprising) was so named because it was spearheaded by Chinese Boxers (i.e.: Kung Fu/Wushu practitioners). And many European martial arts are still practicsed today.

 

Martial arts from around the world

(L-R): Greco-Roman Wrestling, Renaissance Rapier Brawling, African stick fighting, Capoeira (Brazilian slave-variant of African Boxing),  Okinawan Karate, Chinese Xingyi Kung Fu

 

If you want to see an example of traditional American martial arts, watch The Last of the Mohicans (Daniel Day Lewis) - paying attention to their use of arrows, hatchets, axes etc. in battle, particularly against the British who fought back with rifles. History has shown us many examples of superior martial arts skills - combined with good military tactics, can allow an army to overwhelm an enemy with superior weapons technology. e.g.: Shaka Zulu vs the British and the British vs the Maori Nation; the Maori fought so brutally that the British were forced to sign a treaty (the Treaty of Waitangi) with the Maori. Although Maori martial arts have since been lost, their famous war cry, the Haka, is still used in many dances and New Zealand sporting events today.

 

So for an entire planet with millions of years' history of conflict, it would certainly stand to reason that they would have developed martial arts.

[Darkhammer]

*its time for Fanboy bashing!*

 

You people are Powerglideing pathetic for argueing about some stupid show... that Transformer martial art can't be compared to anything martial art of today or the past... nothing!

 

BTW- Overhaul tought Optimus that martial art in Cybertron.... so its unarmed combat!

 

IF Msterforce was so damn good, the why wasn't it shown over here? in english.

 

Ginrai made Masterforce not the pretenders!

[trench]

robots knowing kung fu is lame.

If you want to see an example of traditional American martial arts, watch The Last of the Mohicans (Daniel Day Lewis) - paying attention to their use of arrows, hatchets, axes etc. in battle, particularly against the British who fought back with rifles. History has shown us many examples of superior martial arts skills - combined with good military tactics, can allow an army to overwhelm an enemy with superior weapons technology. e.g.: Shaka Zulu vs the British and the British vs the Maori Nation; the Maori fought so brutally that the British were forced to sign a treaty (the Treaty of Waitangi) with the Maori.

Come on dude, you can't use 150 year-old examples - a modern automatic rifle would mow down a whole platoon of spear-chucking natives.

 

I know a bunch of MMA and kickboxers that won't go anywhere near a guy with a pistol.  Because of a simple concept:  guns beat fists - no matter how many Steven Segal or Chuck Norris movies you watch.

[Lord Madhammer]

True, but if you're a soldier or whatever, you're going to need to know hand-to-hand combat and stuff.

 

As *part* of your overall training... relying on a sword or your fists or whatever is silly

[trench]

True, but if you're a soldier or whatever, you're going to need to know hand-to-hand combat and stuff.

 

As *part* of your overall training... relying on a sword or your fists or whatever is silly

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ironically, most "official" hand-to-hand training in the US military today is done more for exercise and confidence building.  Generally because most martial arts can only really be directed to one opponent at a time, you don't want to be kung-fu fighting with one enemy and have another enemy shoot you in the head or stick a bayonet into your back if you're wrestling around on the ground.  (Plus, in most combat situations soldiers are usually wearing backpacks and a load of other gear which weighs them down and minimizes the effectivness of hand-to-hand fighting).

 

However, most special-ops guys do learn martial arts on their own time, but in reality it's probably not terribly practical since these guys are trained to fight in squads - I'm sure they learn it more to take down sentries quietly with a knife, etc.

[Goktimus Prime]

trench: you're right, in modern warfare, there is little need for hand-to-hand martial arts, which is why martial arts developed during modern times are pretty ordinary compared to older styles - e.g.: Taekwondo is generally considered to be a fairly weak excuse for a martial art - even its combative form is pretty mediocre, as TKD was developed after the advent of the sub-machine gun. TKD punches are a joke because the style presumes that you are carrying an M-16. The style works effectively for S.Korean soldiers, because S.Korean modern soldiers are armed with modern weapons. But S.Korean Vietnam War veterans will say that there were many times when their TKD came in use, such as times when they needed to dispose of an enemy in relative silence -- the scuffle of a close-range fight is quieter than discharging a firearm.

 

We cannot presume that the Transformers would've had modern automatic ballistic weaponry all the time -- at some point in their far flung distant past, they would have had more ancient weapons and bare handed fighting. Although a minority, there are some Transformers who still use ancient weapons, like swords.

 

Guns are fantastic range weapons - and automatic guns means that it is highly unlikely that an opponent could ever come close enough to clobber you. However, if they can get close enough, then a gun becomes a far less effective weapon, and you will need to resort to close-quarter combat techniques. This is why machine gun stocks are so chunky - so that you can use them as clubs. Bayonets, machetes etc are also there for you to use for close quarter fighting where shooting is no longer effective - even the good old fashion pistol-whipping.

 

Now, remember that Transformer are giant super robots with armour plating. Some of these guys can take a couple of shots before going down -- and if possible, they will take a few shots in order to get close enough to smack you. At such close range, a gun becomes a far less effective weapon. For example, when Grimlock went toe-to-toe with Fangry, Fangry blasted him with his tail gun, but as a heavily armoured and extremely durable Dinobot (and supposedly powered-up as an Action Master), Grimlock just took Fangry's fire, waltzed straight up to him where shooting was no longer effective, and then commenced beating nine colours of Blot out of him with his fists.

 

Nobody is suggesting that the Transformers use their martial arts exclusively in battle... or even use them primarily in battle. The advent of automatic ballistic firearms has largely removed that need. But with a history of warfare spanning millions and millions of years, it would stand to reason that back in their more primitive days, they would have developed more primal forms of combat. And as suggested before, there are certain occasions which call for close-quarter fighting as opposed to using a gun.

 

Furthermore, Cybertronian martial arts do differ from human martial arts in that they have evolved to be used alongside modern warfare -- hence why Cybertronian martial artists are able to perform super athletic feats, such as incredible leaps (feats that would be utterly impossible for humans to perform) - as well as energy discharges etc. - it's all explained in the Cybertronian Martial Arts Compendium. Unlike humans, some Transformers can move fast enough to dodge bullets (e.g.: Banzaitron) and even if they can't - these are armoured super robots, not puny men of flesh.

[XLR-8]

Did anyone hear mention about Cybertron Episode 8? Optimus prime mention Metalliko and says he had a good teacher when training Landmine at homebase?

[Teh INTERNETS ^_^]

Did anyone post this image? I said I don't like the dude, but this is tight...

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Now that is cool, whats it from?

 

On the topic of guns or martial arts: Since it usually takes alot of weapon fire to down a transfformer hand to hand combat is often a much quicker solution.

[XLR-8]

Now that is cool, whats it from?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Its a Fan Drawn Image of Bludgeon.

 

:thumb

[Goktimus Prime]

The picture is based on that part of the post Time Wars Survivors story arc where Carnivac attacked the Decepticon Mayhem Attack Squad's base to exact revenge on Bludgeon for killing Catilla.