...to defend against the distrcit's 110 students.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080815/ts_nm/texas_guns_dc

I say, "cool."

In a place this small guns are such a reality of life anyway that most of the elementary school students have likely fired one and been taught the basics of firearm safety...which is exactly why the teachers probably don't need to defend themselves, but whatever.

yeah but some could be crazy

More guns, of course, what a great solution.

Interesting...

I don't know if I'd call it a solution because they don't seem to be having a problem (beyond mass media induced fear of their own children, of course).

Heh, I was such an smart-alecky a-hole to my teachers that I definitely would have been shot if they had been strapped.

This will sound all cool and macho until some kid gets a D, loses their shpedoinkle and kills 12 people with their teachers gun.

Or better yet, when Mrs. Epstein blows some 3rd graders head into the black board for playing Cops and Robbers to convincingly.

Thanks, I've now got the mental image of a Sweathog in drag to purge from my mind's eye.

For reference; allowing teachers to take guns to school is one of those things that makes the rest of the world think that America is fucking insane.

For the record, I'm pretty big on gun rights. But to me, a school is one of the places where the risks outweigh the benefits.

But the kid had a note...

A death note?




just had to.

I just realised that fudge packing used to be illegal in Texas. (You know, before the 2003 Supreme Court decision)


What the hell is wrong with these people?!

"You wanna take a loaded gun into a class full of children? Sure, why not, what's the worse that could happen? By the way, you check out the rack on that blonde? What?! You like it up the where now?! Sorry sir, but I'm gonna have to arrest you for that."

Hey, it was illegal in my state too. America is weird, thank goodness we have the Japanese to compare to.

Don't forget that both presidential candidates had to go suck Rick Warren's dick last night.

I'm not saying this is ok, but I'll be devils advocate.

I think you guys are missing the idea. they want the teachers to be able to protect the kids from an outside intruder(who tend to target elementary schools for various reasons), not the kids. and there is this


its not like their saying everybody can bring one.


ok, that's over. while I feel the schools should enact some security measures, letting the teachers bring guns is probably not the most ideal solution.
of course, the libertarian in me has to say...IF the taxpayers and parents who pay for the school system are supporting this, then its really noone elses business.

for Haggis, every country does things other countries don't understand. I mean look at Canada.[/joke]

If they want security, maybe they should hire some security professionals. Teachers are there to teach. JMO

Well, they want the teacher to have the option to feel secure. They don't actually want to spend money on forcing security on people or anything.



I think everyone's also missing (or at least failing to comment on) the absurdity of the fear that an entire district composed of 110 students would be victim to some random shooting. Do you even have an "outcast emo clique" who could snap and go shooting with only 110 students in your elementary, middle, and high schools combined? Isn't everyone popular and happy with only 110 students around? Don't they think if someone started acting weird they'd be noticed?

And isn't this a "the gym teacher is also the acting sheriff" situation? So you know he's packing. And I'd lay ten bucks on the fact that there is at least one hunting rifle left in a teacher's car on school grounds probably 40% of the time to begin with - and odds are good that hunting rifle owning teacher drove their kid to school with them.

It's ridiculous this is even being reported as news.

I think that comment is the only absurd thing here... to assume that a Columbine-type shooting is the only possible scenario. (Also to assume that a low population = lack of discontent.)

And about teachers feeling secure... I'd rather they actually be secure if it's that much of an issue for them. If my kid's teacher told me that he/she was going to be bringing a gun to class every day, I don't think the first question on my lips would be "but are you properly trained in the use and care of firearms?".

It doesn't result in a lack of discontent, it results in a lack of "invisibility." When there's only 30 other kids in your school, you don't blend in to the background as much and when you start acting weird, people pick up on it. You get the proper attention. That helps to offset disasters of this magnitude.




I'd argue that they are. They've already got cameras and a "lock-down situation" set-up. Seriously, what are they afraid of?


It wouldn't be my first question, either. But it would be on my list of questions.

This is the way I see that going down:
-Suspicious person enters building.
-Someone calls for "lockdown" or whatever. Most school systems have such a protocol.
-Teachers hear the call and draw their weapons, venturing out into the hallway to see what's going on. Some teacher whose heart and adrenaline are racing takes a shot at something that moved.
-A split second later, they realize it was a kid or another teacher.

I realize the crisis training is there to offset this, but I still think this would be the more likely scenario. You'd be better off having police there (though I realize then it becomes a money issue, so it's a bit of a catch-22).



This is about right. If the families are all okay with it, then I guess it's okay. Although I think every parent should have to sign off on it. I don't think anyone should have to put their child in a situation they believe could be dangerous just because a majority of other parents deemed it fine.

"Gee he seemed like such a nice guy..." How many times have we heard that?

But that's not my point. I think you're wrong about this, but that's not directly relevant to what I was saying. Which is that people *other* than disgruntled students can shoot guns, too.

So, you're arguing against the teachers carrying guns, but arguing for the idea that they should be scared enough to carry them? Sometimes I don't get you, Pete.

Probably because you misunderstood me. You were focusing on disgruntled students being the source of gun violence in schools, as if there could be no other way it could happen. And I was saying "hello, duh, anyone could walk into a school and shoot the place up; you don't have to be an emo kid in order to do that." That was my point.

But about this whole connection you've made between "teacher fear" and "teachers carrying guns"... I think that logic is fundamentally flawed, because it assumes (falsely) that the best way to make schools safer (and thereby reduce teacher fear) is to allow the teachers to carry guns. In order for that to be logically valid, you would have to demonstrate that school safety is optimized when teachers carry guns at school. My point there is that you would be a lot better served (if indeed the issue were serious enough to warrant such an approach) by hiring trained professionals. Do you ever see a company that, instead of hiring a security firm, instead gives its employees a course in gun safety and tells them to bring their own guns to work? The very notion is utterly ridiculous. And yet, that's exactly what we're doing here... in the presence of children, no less. Brilliant.

I'm guessing that's not in the protocol.

It's not like they had to.

That isn't my logic. It is their logic. It is why they are carrying the guns. To be safer. The article states as much. No matter how illogical you determine the connection between guns and safety to be, it is why they are doing what they are doing. This is not some random idea I brought to the discussion. It is the very root cause of their behavior.

I'm saying - even though I am pro-gun rights - to them that you're a school district of 110 kids in rural Texas, not a school district of several thousand kids in the midst of Urban Detroit, Washington DC, or any other high crime area. What is it, exactly, that you're so scared of that you need teachers carrying guns in the school?

You seem to be saying that they are retarded for bringing guns into schools but that, yes, they are right to be scared of any crazy nutjob walking in and shooting the place up, it's just that armed teachers aren't the answer to that very real problem.

I think if the electorate of Texas is willing to vote for this their educational institutions clearly have bigger problems then flying lead.

Which is impressive in a really sick sad way.

Oh, it's not the whole state. Let's not attack all my friends and relatives based on a single small town.

But...everyone else does it!

Apart from the wierd comics, comparing violent crime rates I know where I'd prefer to live (Australia ).



I think I've made it known before that I don't like guns. But, I also don't care if you have a personal handgun in your house for your own protection. Statistically you're more likely to shoot a family member than an intruder, but hey, that's your choice. Allowing Teachers to take guns into a School doesn't really fall under "gun rights" to me. Even if your high school has 1000 students and a group of scary kids wearing too much eye make up.

*realises he's arguing with a person who probably agrees with him*

Yup.

I'm not advocating guns in schools - however, that being said, I don't think this one small school district will suffer any ill-effects from the policy. But I realize that doesn't make it a good idea.

But I'm still baffled as to what would prompt this school district to take this action.

You know, its funny.

I have four, (count 'em, FOUR) firearms in my home. I even carry one around with me from time to time. Not a single one has ever killed a person. I've never even pointed one at anything living other than a few unfortunate squirrels, snakes and turtles. I've, SOMEHOW, managed to live the last 20 years without shooting a family member (accidentally or otherwise). What's more, I've never even once had one taken from me and had it used on me or someone else.

I must be living right.

Wait, why turtles?

Well, they're practically begging for it, what with wearing nature's flack jackets and all.

TURTLES: Nature's Target

I know, right?

"Turtle" = Red Eared Slider Terrapin in southern parlance. I have a fish pond on my property where I keep blue gill and bass stocked. Terrapins get in the pond and can eat all the baby fish and the their food source. The bass population is down a good bit. I've already got my hands full because catfish have gotten in the pond as well. (It's so bad that the catfish don't even reach full size, they don't grow beyond about six inches.) If I can catch a turtle on dry land I take down to a bayou about a quarter mile from my house and release them, but sometimes I can't catch them on dry land.

I have pet Red Eared Sliders. They love to eat grapes.

They eat everything.

And there are no grapes in my pond that they swim in.

well plant some grapes...NEOCON!



turtles make a fine soup. but i prefer squirrel dumplings. or backstrap n biscuits.

Yeah, see? You were baggin' on me for living in Louisiana, but about once a week there's a guy up here at the office that whips out the electric griddle and cooks up some deer sausage for everyone.

that's cool. i'm gonna go eat some southern style barbeque now which I can find on any corner here in GA. how's that homemade stuff going for you?

Are you seriously trying to out-hick each other?

redneck, my friend, out-redneck each other.

*bets he has Nomolos beaten because he has never had an uncle pull up to a family 4th of July fish fry and say "Hey, y'all come look at the dead Bobcat in the back of my truck!" and everyone actually goes and looks.*


I have never tasted its equal by actually having to purchase it from someone esle.

Jesus, no wonder you guys think the Fair Tax would work. You must still trade odd jobs for a plate of biscuits. You've never been anywhere near real money.

Barter system FTW, what is this "money" you speak of?

you guys must kick ass at D&D

Except D&D is "of the devil" and thus I am forbidden by my right-wing Christian extremist leanings from playing it.

And really, Hobbes, it depends on how good the biscuits are.

JACK CHICK